I am Iron Man

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Welcome to M4 Medicine, mystery,
mayhem, and sometimes murder.

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I'm Andrea Marciano and RN with
35 years of experience across

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various fields.
From direct patient care in

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hospitals to home health,
geriatrics, and injury medicine,

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I face life, death, and
everything in between.

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And I'm Crystal Miller and RN
with 13 1/2 years of experience.

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My work spans home health,
Hospice, emergency care,

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geriatrics, and occupational
health.

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From the chaos of trauma based
quiet moments with patients,

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I've seen stories that defy
explanations.

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We've been friends for over 25
years and as nurses we've shared

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countless stories that have left
us and our families speechless.

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Now we're bringing those stories
and many more to you in

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medicine, mystery, mayhem, and
sometimes murder.

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Each week, we'll uncover cases
that challenge the boundaries of

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medicine, sharing the human
stories behind the science.

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From puzzling medical mysteries
to shocking real life crimes,

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we'll bring you stories that'll
leave you questioning everything

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you thought you knew while.
We're both experiencing treats,

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nurses.
We want to make it clear we're

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not here to give medical advice.
This podcast is about

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storytelling, education and
exploration, not diagnosing or

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treating medical conditions.
This is medicine, mystery,

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mayhem and sometimes murder.
Let's dive in.

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Hey Crystal, how are you doing?
I'm doing great.

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How are you?
I am very well, thank you.

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What's going on in your life?
Anything exciting?

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Yeah, so my little sister and
little, she's 45, I think maybe

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a younger sister and two of her
daughters came out to visit,

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visit us from Utah last week and
we had a blast.

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One of her daughters just had a
baby about six weeks ago and the

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other is pregnant with twins.
And so we got to see my sister's

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new grandbaby.
And just like, we just had a lot

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of fun.
We went to we went to the Museum

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of Osteology, which is a bone
museum here in Moore, where I

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live.
We went to, Oh my gosh, why am

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I?
Why am I forgetting all of a

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sudden?
I don't know, but let me ask,

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why on earth do you have a bone
museum?

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There's just a guy who was
really interested in bones and I

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think he's from here, so he just
made a bone museum.

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That reminds me of Oh my gosh.
So I when I was dating, I was on

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an online thing and somebody had
put that they were an orthopedic

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surgeon or no, a surgeon, and I
said, really, what area of

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specialty are you?
And he said I like bones.

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So I was fairly certain a he was
a surgeon and BA very smart

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person but it just reminded me
that knowing that there was a

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bone museum, I wonder if it was
the same guy.

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Maybe who knows, but we went to
a thing called Pumpkinville,

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which you from being from Utah
are, you know, having lived in

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Utah, it's very similar to like
oh, Gardner Village, like

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Gardner Village.
Not permanent structures though,

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just booths, but it was really
cute.

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Just as they had like artwork
that had been recreated with

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pumpkins in it for for example,
one of the examples was they had

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Vincent Van Gogh's pumpkin the
night.

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Right.
So the starry night, they were

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really cute American.
So instead of American Gothic,

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it was American pumpkin.
So it.

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Was 22 pumpkin heads standing
with tools?

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No, actually the two.
People with the pumpkin on the

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pitchfork.
Oh my gosh, I don't know.

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Were these things for sale or
was it just just for?

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Display just for the, for the
thing, the just for the event.

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And then we went to the the what
is it called?

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It's the Greek conservation
greenhouse.

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And we went also, we Sunny Joe
found, it's my sister.

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She found a, a, an alley that's
all murals.

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It's called like murals at Plaza
Street or something like that.

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So we went and looked at the
murals, then did some shopping.

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It was a lot of fun.
It was so much fun.

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And we got to catch up and yeah.
That sounds awesome.

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We went to an alley like that,
but I I believe it was in

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Philadelphia.
There's one like for sure in

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Boise, and I've been to that
one.

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The one in Boise is bigger, but
it was still really great.

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Really great artwork, very
diverse, just lovely.

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Well, that's what I liked about
this.

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It was just some odd alley and
there were live businesses that

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worked into the alley.
I mean, they would bring her

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step in through and that sort of
thing.

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And we did see one door open,
which was odd because it was an

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art covered door.
And then right when it opens,

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I'm like, oh, hey, this because
it's kind of easy.

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At least it was for me easy to
forget it was a building that I

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was looking at cause some of the
things were so amazing and other

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things were really cool.
Not as as talented artists as

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far as the classical sense, but
they use beautiful colors.

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And there was one that had
stained glass on it and that

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I've always been attracted to
stained glass.

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And in fact, I picked up a
Joshua, my son's property.

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I picked up a bunch of pieces of
stained glass that somebody had

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with a big piece of property.
People usually dump junk

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everywhere.
Well, there was this whole pile

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of glass that that must have
been where they dumped it.

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And so I sat out there for about
2 1/2 hours picking up all this

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glass that I do need to now
decide what to do with.

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But I.
How many acres does he have?

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11 1/2 or 11, but we have 11
1/2.

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He has eleven.
Yeah.

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Wow.
Anyways, crazy.

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Yeah.
He's like, what are you doing,

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mom?
I'm like, well, anyway, but

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that's not so much fun.
It's.

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It was a lot of fun to let her
see where you're living now too,

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right.
Because.

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Yes, for sure, because she so
far only my parents have been

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out here.
So now they've been out here.

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I love my house and like I'm
really proud of my house.

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And I don't mean proud like
there's nothing special about

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it.
It's not huge.

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It's, it's just, it's just
perfect for me and my family.

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The way it looks now, you know,
and I, I, I had a little bit of

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money from the sale of my Utah
house to do some new furniture

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and like to do like to be a
little more conscious, yeah

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conscious of what I was putting
into the house because I, you

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know, I raised 7 little kids
and, and I just was like, you

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guys can destroy everything I'm
not going to replace it till

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you're older and.
That day came and that day came,

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Yeah.
And it's just.

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Really cute and I really love it
and it's just I really feel at

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home here.
And until you've seen it, you

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know it's hard to understand.
Yeah, I get that well.

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And where we live reflects a lot
of who we are.

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Yeah.
All of it.

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I mean, everything from the
cobwebs in the corner to the

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plants on the other side, you
know?

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Oh wait, that's my sorry, I was
distracted anyway.

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Well, that's so awesome.
I'm so happy for you.

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I love that.
And also it sounds like it's

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really good connecting
opportunity for all of you for.

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Sure.
Yeah, it was great.

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And I cannot believe the babies
are having babies.

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I know that there's they're way
younger than anyway.

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No, it's not.
It's not that I'm 60.

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It's that they're young.
They're babies.

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Yeah.
Yeah.

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Anyway, well, the topic we have
for today is something that is,

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it's really interesting to me.
It's about the iron lung.

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Have you heard?
You've heard about the iron

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lung, haven't you?
I.

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Have heard about the iron lung.
I obviously because it's not

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used in medicine anymore.
I don't know a lot about it.

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I've never used one.
I mean it, you know, it's kind

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of just a historical thing that
I know about.

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I think.
I think they treated polio and

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tuberculosis with it or
something.

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I my knowledge and it's like
your knowledge, right?

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That was me guessing or trying
to.

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Hurt.
Who knows?

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Yeah, the polio thing was
correct.

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And we'll talk more about
exactly how it came about.

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I actually thought that the iron
lung was invented to deal with

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polio, but we'll talk about the
history with it and, and it

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wasn't my sources today are, you
know, I, I hate, I'm embarrassed

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to say that I looked things up
on Wikipedia, but I did.

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Here's the thing.
If the Wikipedia entry has

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sources that are legitimate
sources, go for it.

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That's my opinion.
OK, so my sources are

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description of the iron lung
from Wikipedia and an article

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called the Man in the iron Lung
and this was in the bbc.com news

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publication and it's the title
was how Paul Alexander lived

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Life to the full and the iron
lung Science, Technology and

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society.
A student LED exploration and

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this was from Clemson
University.

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I used parts of all of this to
get what I came up with.

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So here it is now since since we
both are younger than having use

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of iron lung was common.
Since we've both been vaccinated

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for polio.
And we will talk about that as

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well.
But yes, because those vaccines

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are huge and they had almost
eradicated polio and there is a

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resurgence.
We don't get political in the

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show, but there is a resurgence
and it does seem to be linked to

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a lack of vaccinations.
Yes, correct.

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And that's what we'll say about
that for now.

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An iron lung is a type of
negative pressure ventilator,

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and it's a mechanical
respirator.

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And what it does is it encloses
most of the person's body and

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then varies the air pressure in
the enclosed space to stimulate

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breathing.
Now I sent you a picture of my

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great uncle who was actually in
an iron lung, as far as I know,

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until his death, and I'm
waiting.

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Oh, and my dad said it was from
about 1949 or 1950 and it was

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about two to three years
duration.

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And that was my great uncle.
I have a picture that I put in

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her chat.
We can probably later put in the

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show notes with him in it.
So we'll talk a little bit more

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about how he could have been in
for a short period of time

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versus a long time.
And there's a reason for that.

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But anyway, so this iron lung
totally encapsulates a person

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except for their head.
That's all that sticks out is

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their head.
Wow, I don't even know if I

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could take it.
But I don't either think about

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an MRI machine.
I mean, granted your head is

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also in the machine, but I hate
those things.

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And it's not because of the
noises.

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I couldn't care less about the
noises.

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It's the claustrophobia, I
guess.

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I mean, I don't know that I am
claustrophobic in all

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circumstances of enclosed
spaces, but I know that I do

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start to get anxious when I'm
having an MRI as opposed to ACT

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scan right?
Which is open and no big deal.

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Sure, and the reason I feel like
I don't have any anxiety in an

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MRI is because I know I can get
out because I'm not very big and

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so I know I could actually turn
if I needed to or just scuttle

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my way out.
But I've seen people in there

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that they are totally touching
the edges.

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They're wedged, yeah.
I know.

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And I'm like, I would be more
concerned, I think at that

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point.
And the iron lung is more of

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that sort of thing where they're
stuck.

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They're really stuck in there.
The point of an iron lung, as I

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said, is it's a mechanical
respirator and it assists

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breathing when muscle control is
lost.

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And there's a variety of reasons
that can happen.

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We'll be talking more about the
polio one this time.

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Also, they have the thing where
they lose muscle control.

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So if you think of something
like Lou Gehrig's or something

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like that, that the the lung
ability to move the muscles

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around the lungs is lost.
This would have been in history

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what they would use.
Or also sometimes the work of

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breathing exceeds their ability.
Like say they have in history if

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they had a really bad pneumonia
or something and they just

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couldn't do it.
Or maybe they were in an

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accident and they were
unconscious and they couldn't do

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it for whatever reason they
might have been.

227
00:11:20,360 --> 00:11:23,320
Is this pre intubation or do
they overlap?

228
00:11:23,880 --> 00:11:26,160
Do they?
Overlap, well, they overlap some

229
00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:29,960
and then we'll talk a little bit
about what how that occurs.

230
00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:33,160
So no, it's a good question
because I was wondering the same

231
00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:34,840
thing.
But the need for the treatment

232
00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:37,520
of an iron lung might result
from polio.

233
00:11:37,520 --> 00:11:42,640
Like we talked about Botulism or
block jaw can have it can be one

234
00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:45,680
of the things that come up and
certain poisons, so barbiturates

235
00:11:45,680 --> 00:11:49,760
and turbo curing.
And so that would be the

236
00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:53,200
paralytics of the respiratory
muscles.

237
00:11:53,200 --> 00:11:56,120
The use of the iron lung is
largely obsolete as we were

238
00:11:56,120 --> 00:11:59,480
talking about because there are
more modern breathing therapies

239
00:11:59,560 --> 00:12:03,520
that have been developed due to
the eradication of polio.

240
00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:07,760
With our side note of used to be
in most of the world polio was

241
00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:10,520
the biggest reason people use
these iron lungs.

242
00:12:10,840 --> 00:12:14,720
But in 2020, the COVID pandemic
revised some interest in them

243
00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:17,480
because they were cheap air
quotes, because they had been

244
00:12:17,480 --> 00:12:21,240
paid off, I mean.
Right years ago, 75 years.

245
00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:25,520
Ago yeah yeah some of them even
that part they were readily

246
00:12:25,520 --> 00:12:28,960
produce reproducible for the
positive pressure ventilators.

247
00:12:29,160 --> 00:12:33,600
Remember when so many yes, but
in this positive pressure.

248
00:12:34,640 --> 00:12:37,800
Well, they the iron lung is a
negative pressure.

249
00:12:37,800 --> 00:12:41,680
The substitutes now have
positive pressure ventilators.

250
00:12:42,120 --> 00:12:46,560
So instead of having external
pressure, we have internal

251
00:12:46,560 --> 00:12:48,800
pressure.
So that's the that's the

252
00:12:48,800 --> 00:12:50,160
difference.
Yeah, thanks for that.

253
00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:53,160
So just in case I did say
something super goofy, which I

254
00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:58,560
have done but when and so do you
remember during COVID when

255
00:12:58,560 --> 00:13:00,880
people were worried that we'd
run out of ventilators and in

256
00:13:00,880 --> 00:13:04,480
some places they we did they
were considering using these

257
00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:07,520
especially third world countries
that had fewer of everything

258
00:13:07,520 --> 00:13:11,400
anyway, I know that I had read
that they had a few of these

259
00:13:11,400 --> 00:13:16,320
back, but they end up needing
unfortunately and as we

260
00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:21,400
described a little bit the iron
lung is a large horizontal

261
00:13:21,400 --> 00:13:25,400
cylinder designed to stimulate
breathing in patients who have

262
00:13:25,400 --> 00:13:27,000
lost control of the respiratory
muscles.

263
00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:32,440
As we've discussed this cylinder
I saw a big picture that they

264
00:13:32,440 --> 00:13:35,480
had taken a bunch of these iron
lungs and it was in some kind of

265
00:13:35,480 --> 00:13:36,720
movie.
They didn't say what the movie

266
00:13:36,720 --> 00:13:40,440
was but they set up this whole
room that was filled with iron

267
00:13:40,440 --> 00:13:43,160
lungs and I noticed that they
were different sizes.

268
00:13:43,160 --> 00:13:47,960
So apparently they had some for
children, some for adults, and

269
00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:51,080
maybe they even had male, female
because of size, because it has

270
00:13:51,080 --> 00:13:55,160
to be the appropriate ratio, the
way I I read it to be correct

271
00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:57,120
for the person.
So if there was too much

272
00:13:57,120 --> 00:13:58,720
pressure for a person, that
wouldn't work.

273
00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:00,720
And if there wasn't enough
pressure, it wouldn't work.

274
00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:03,520
And.
I, I don't know that this is the

275
00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:07,160
case, but what that conjures up
for me is the idea of like a

276
00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:10,560
blood pressure cuff, right?
Where as you're adding air to

277
00:14:10,560 --> 00:14:16,040
it, it's, it's conforming to the
shapes and and hills and valleys

278
00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:18,400
of your body.
Is it like like that or is it

279
00:14:18,920 --> 00:14:21,480
like?
I don't think quite like that

280
00:14:21,480 --> 00:14:24,000
because I don't think that,
well, what it said here and

281
00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:27,080
everything I read is that so the
body's sealed inside.

282
00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:30,840
I'm like sealed inside because
it has to be sealed.

283
00:14:31,000 --> 00:14:33,680
It has to be, I don't know.
I don't know a lot about these

284
00:14:33,680 --> 00:14:37,280
things, but I envision a vacuum.
It's got to have that pressure

285
00:14:37,280 --> 00:14:40,000
that can't be released except
for with the machinery.

286
00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:41,960
So the only thing that's open is
their head.

287
00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:46,360
I'm not exactly sure how they
kept the air in.

288
00:14:46,360 --> 00:14:49,400
I'm thinking it must have been
sort of a baffle or something.

289
00:14:49,640 --> 00:14:52,600
So not only were you in this
device, but then also something

290
00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:54,560
really tight around the neck and
that would drive me.

291
00:14:54,640 --> 00:14:56,520
I can't even wear it.
I would die.

292
00:14:56,520 --> 00:14:59,000
I can't wear T-shirts.
I can't wear T-shirts because

293
00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:01,800
the necklines are too tight.
Right, Even the T-shirt I have

294
00:15:01,800 --> 00:15:04,080
on them right now, it's a loose
neckline, but it's still too

295
00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:05,880
high.
I have to cut them off.

296
00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:11,240
At any rate, Another another
look into the minds of the Coast

297
00:15:11,240 --> 00:15:16,360
hosts on the show.
But with their head exposed,

298
00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:19,960
they're sealed inside.
So the air pressure is cycled to

299
00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:22,080
facilitate inhalation and
exhalation.

300
00:15:22,760 --> 00:15:27,520
And they had different different
devices, but the main known ones

301
00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:30,600
were called developed by a
person named Drinker and a

302
00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:34,960
person named Emerson.
And those were just, I guess the

303
00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:37,880
brand names, if you will, of of
these things.

304
00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:42,280
And one of the things they did
not address very much, but they

305
00:15:42,280 --> 00:15:46,240
talked slightly about it was if
a person was in this and the

306
00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:50,160
only thing exposed was their
head, how were pressure sores

307
00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:52,640
and things like that avoided?
That's I was waiting.

308
00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:54,960
I was going to say I have so
many questions like how do you

309
00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:59,000
cleanliness?
What about what hygiene?

310
00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:00,840
What about yeah pressure sore
like?

311
00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:03,960
And what's that?
We'll talk a little bit about

312
00:16:03,960 --> 00:16:06,000
it, but they didn't talk about
it very much.

313
00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:10,040
And I thought, well, that would
be one of my primary concerns

314
00:16:10,080 --> 00:16:13,560
and going to the bathroom.
And does this mean that a person

315
00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:15,560
is catheterized for their entire
lives?

316
00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:18,320
I don't know, because it seems
like they'd have to be.

317
00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:21,800
I didn't see anything about
that, those particular things.

318
00:16:21,800 --> 00:16:25,600
And it could be too that because
it was older time, they maybe

319
00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:28,000
just never talked about it.
I just don't understand.

320
00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:30,640
But we're getting slightly off
topic for right now because

321
00:16:30,920 --> 00:16:32,400
we'll talk.
No, we'll talk more about it

322
00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:34,840
because these are the things
that I was wondering as well.

323
00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:40,560
And there are smaller versions
of the iron lung, which were a

324
00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:43,600
jacket ventilator, which only
includes the torso, which

325
00:16:43,880 --> 00:16:46,960
perhaps I could have dealt with.
These people really had a choice

326
00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:50,400
of using this or dying.
I mean, it's not like there were

327
00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:54,800
a ton of options at that time.
I just, every time I think about

328
00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:57,640
it, I get the heebie jeebies
because I just don't know if I

329
00:16:57,640 --> 00:16:59,320
could deal with it.
Even if I knew I was going to

330
00:16:59,320 --> 00:17:01,200
survive with it.
It's just like, well, that's.

331
00:17:01,200 --> 00:17:03,400
What I was going to say maybe
I'd have to maybe I'd have to be

332
00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:05,160
sedated.
I know because I do feel like

333
00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:08,560
with I know how I feel with
something around my neck, you

334
00:17:08,560 --> 00:17:12,359
know, that's even slightly tight
at all, like AT shirt collar

335
00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:16,560
like a regular T-shirt collar.
I can foresee myself being

336
00:17:16,599 --> 00:17:19,760
unreasonable and saying I would
rather die than be feeling this

337
00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:23,839
feeling.
So like, you know, I and also, I

338
00:17:23,839 --> 00:17:25,240
mean it was the I've been
thinking about all of the

339
00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:28,760
million minute, obviously,
right, But also like if I, if my

340
00:17:28,760 --> 00:17:32,000
prognosis was poor, then I
probably would also be like,

341
00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:36,480
Nah, no thanks, right, But maybe
maybe if given a, a strong good

342
00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:40,160
prognosis and being sedated for
the time that I'm in it, maybe

343
00:17:40,160 --> 00:17:42,240
that would work.
But I just can't imagine being

344
00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:46,400
fully conscious and and living
with that.

345
00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:48,560
I just can't.
I Oh, I can't imagine.

346
00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:50,200
Yeah.
And there's some stories that

347
00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:52,520
I'll talk about that are just
remarkable.

348
00:17:53,120 --> 00:17:54,920
So I want to back up just a
minute.

349
00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:58,800
So to discuss how breathing
occurs, Now, breathing in

350
00:17:58,800 --> 00:18:02,280
different kind of living beings
can be slightly different, but

351
00:18:02,280 --> 00:18:06,040
there are some main things that
mammals have in common anyway.

352
00:18:06,520 --> 00:18:09,480
But we'll speak specifically
about humans because I don't

353
00:18:09,480 --> 00:18:12,360
know that any other animal has
been put into an iron lung.

354
00:18:12,360 --> 00:18:15,280
I never saw anything about it.
Hi, put this elephant in here,

355
00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:17,560
won't you?
That'd be a thing.

356
00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:21,400
Breathing in humans occurs
through negative pressure, and

357
00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:25,440
so the rib cage expands and the
diaphragm contracts, which

358
00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:27,760
causes the air to flow in and
out of the lungs.

359
00:18:28,440 --> 00:18:30,640
Now most of the time we're
completely unaware of this

360
00:18:30,640 --> 00:18:33,680
happening because our body just
naturally does it.

361
00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:36,840
It's so it's not even anything
we think about unless we have a

362
00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:40,200
problem like we have a cracked
rib or something happens with

363
00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:44,400
our diaphragm or we have hiccup
because that's the diaphragm

364
00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:47,800
being in spasm usually.
That's usually the 'cause there

365
00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:49,880
are some other things, but
that's the most common cause.

366
00:18:50,320 --> 00:18:52,080
But most of the time we don't
even think about it.

367
00:18:52,080 --> 00:18:55,600
The concept of the external
negative pressure ventilation

368
00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:59,520
was introduced by John Mayo in
1670.

369
00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:02,600
Which, you know, when I hear
people who have thought of stuff

370
00:19:02,600 --> 00:19:06,120
like this that long ago I was
like, wow, that's a smart

371
00:19:06,120 --> 00:19:09,680
person.
Because I even now I don't know

372
00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:12,360
if I could figure out how to
make a machine that could do

373
00:19:12,360 --> 00:19:14,840
that with all the technology and
everything available to me, I

374
00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:16,000
said.
No kidding.

375
00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:19,480
So people I wouldn't, but I
don't have an engineering, an

376
00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:21,240
engineering mind either.
You know what I mean?

377
00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:26,520
Like I'm way more like artistic
and figure it out not exactly

378
00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:28,840
right.
And if you if you saw the

379
00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:31,280
chicken run I made in the back,
I was figuring it out and it

380
00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:35,440
didn't work.
But that's why we have other

381
00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:38,560
people in our lives like that.
The first widely used device was

382
00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:41,120
of this nature was the iron
lung.

383
00:19:41,160 --> 00:19:44,360
And they call it that based on
what it looked like 'cause it

384
00:19:44,360 --> 00:19:47,480
was iron and it created a a lung
experience.

385
00:19:47,840 --> 00:19:52,760
And they were £650 each.
Yeah.

386
00:19:52,760 --> 00:19:55,720
So it's not like these are just
tiny little things.

387
00:19:56,040 --> 00:19:59,320
And they first started.
They were first developed by

388
00:19:59,320 --> 00:20:03,760
Phillip Drinker and Louis Shaw.
And that's why one of them was

389
00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:06,000
named the Drinker.
I don't know why it wasn't named

390
00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:09,000
the Drinker.
No kidding.

391
00:20:09,600 --> 00:20:13,480
And that was in 1928.
And its initial use was for coal

392
00:20:13,480 --> 00:20:16,120
gas poisoning treatment because
so many people were working in

393
00:20:16,120 --> 00:20:18,960
the coal mines.
They had coal gas.

394
00:20:19,120 --> 00:20:21,000
Poisoning.
No, wait, that's not coal gas.

395
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:24,240
So I just learned at work
actually about a new chemical.

396
00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:26,320
I mean, it's not new.
It's it was used in World War 2.

397
00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:29,800
It's actually illegal to say its
name in France, but I just, it's

398
00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:33,640
like highly caustic and it's a
choking and all this stuff.

399
00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:35,640
But I don't think it comes from
coal, so.

400
00:20:36,120 --> 00:20:38,280
Yeah, I'm not sure.
But I don't know if I should say

401
00:20:38,280 --> 00:20:40,400
it on the podcast, because what
if somebody's listening in

402
00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:42,480
France and then they'd get mad?
I don't know.

403
00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:45,320
I don't know, we'll skip it for.
Now, if you want to, yeah,

404
00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:50,560
that's right.
But but then with this, they

405
00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:53,520
initially used it for that, like
I say, because people, their

406
00:20:53,520 --> 00:20:55,440
lungs were damaged to the point
that they weren't working

407
00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:57,840
properly.
And so this assisted them.

408
00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:02,560
And then the Ireland game fame
by treating respiratory failure

409
00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:06,720
caused by polio as we were
talking about, John Emerson

410
00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:10,080
introduced an improved and more
affordable version in 1931.

411
00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:11,920
So when I read that, I'm like,
oh, what's it?

412
00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:13,920
Everyone get one for the home?
Just, you know, oh, it's

413
00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:15,680
affordable now.
I'll get one.

414
00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:20,280
And if no one needs it for that,
I'll just, yeah, it'll just now

415
00:21:20,280 --> 00:21:23,080
be my casket.
So it would probably feel the

416
00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:26,720
same way.
But apparently it was a cheaper

417
00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:30,760
and lighter alternative and that
other one by the drinker model

418
00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:34,400
was invented in 1937 in
Australia.

419
00:21:34,520 --> 00:21:37,720
Anyway, they had a couple of
other versions that were

420
00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:41,360
created, but apparently the
drinker one was the most common.

421
00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:44,840
A philanthropist William Morris
finance production of a

422
00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:48,400
respirator called it both
Nuffield and he donated them

423
00:21:48,400 --> 00:21:50,720
hospitals through Britain and
the British Empire during the

424
00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:53,200
polio outbreaks in 1940 and
1950s.

425
00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:57,080
So that was awfully nice that
he, he saw a need obviously, and

426
00:21:57,080 --> 00:22:01,240
he donated a bunch of them.
And these iron lungs, while I

427
00:22:01,240 --> 00:22:03,240
was talking about it being a
prop during a movie, they

428
00:22:03,240 --> 00:22:06,800
actually filled the hospitals.
They assisted people who had

429
00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:09,400
paralyzed diaphragms for the
recovery.

430
00:22:09,400 --> 00:22:12,120
And sometimes, and we'll talk
about this more, sometimes it

431
00:22:12,120 --> 00:22:13,840
was temporary and sometimes it
was permanent.

432
00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:18,440
And when we talk about my great,
great uncle, his was temporary.

433
00:22:19,360 --> 00:22:23,960
And so that's that's good news
because and I asked if he just

434
00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:27,520
died after that and he did not.
He just got that's good.

435
00:22:27,960 --> 00:22:30,560
Like, oh, well, it was temporary
because he didn't like I say

436
00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:33,400
because before my time, so I
didn't know him.

437
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:38,280
Now the use of modern
ventilators which as we talked

438
00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:41,080
about are positive pressure and
they blow air into the patient

439
00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:45,560
lung, bring using intubation,
intubation for our listeners who

440
00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:48,040
are unfamiliar with it.
So a ventilator is when they

441
00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:51,680
take a tube and they put it down
your throat through your vocal

442
00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:55,440
cords, place it into your
trachea, avoiding your esophagus

443
00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:57,280
because you don't want air in
your tum, tum.

444
00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:03,720
And then once it's in place,
they attach oxygen to it in a

445
00:23:03,720 --> 00:23:05,640
positive pressure.
So it's a very light pressure

446
00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:07,200
because you don't want to blow
out your lungs.

447
00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:10,000
You know, your lungs are very
delicate little balloons.

448
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:14,200
So it's a very light pressure,
but it is enough to inflate the

449
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:17,040
lungs with oxygen.
And then often you've probably

450
00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:25,280
seen it in movies right where
you hear the machine go and

451
00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:29,320
that's that in and out of the
that's the the in and out

452
00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:33,520
pressure from that machine
basically pumping your lungs for

453
00:23:33,520 --> 00:23:38,040
you both to ingest oxygen.
And it's not really ingest, but

454
00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:39,920
to get absorbed.
Thank you.

455
00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:42,560
Absorb oxygen and release carbon
dioxide.

456
00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:43,720
Very good.
Yeah.

457
00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:46,280
And that's true.
It literally saves lives.

458
00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:49,120
And sometimes, like we've talked
about with this negative

459
00:23:49,120 --> 00:23:52,120
pressure, it would be something
that could hold someone over

460
00:23:52,120 --> 00:23:55,960
while they recover.
And what's interesting to me is

461
00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:58,720
that negative pressure
ventilation is actually more

462
00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:03,280
similar to normal physiological
breathing then the positive

463
00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:07,560
pressure, which I, I guess I
didn't even think about it that

464
00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:10,680
way because the positive
pressure is just replacing what

465
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:14,080
our body does is not stimulating
our body to do the thing that

466
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:16,960
it's supposed to do.
And in some cases the.

467
00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:20,320
Did you say the positive
pressure is not positive?

468
00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:23,000
Pressure is less like what we
normally do.

469
00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:25,520
OK, just OK, sorry I I wasn't
sure.

470
00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:28,560
OK, just digesting or?
You know, yeah, no, no worries.

471
00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:32,520
And negative pressure, though,
can actually be preferable in

472
00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:36,120
rare conditions such such as
central hypoventilation

473
00:24:36,120 --> 00:24:38,200
syndrome, which I did not look
up.

474
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:42,800
And as of we'll talk about this
person who was on an iron lung

475
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,640
for a very long time.
His name was Paula Alexander.

476
00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:48,240
But at this moment, only one
person person in the United

477
00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:50,000
States is still using the iron
lung.

478
00:24:50,120 --> 00:24:51,320
I can't.
Believe there's one.

479
00:24:51,760 --> 00:24:54,760
I know, me too.
We'll talk a little bit more

480
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:57,960
about her later, but I like what
someone's still in an iron lung

481
00:24:57,960 --> 00:24:59,320
somewhere.
That's goodness.

482
00:25:00,360 --> 00:25:04,520
What I was saying before about
COVID is that some enterprises

483
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:07,480
developed prototypes of new,
easily producible version of the

484
00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:10,720
iron lung in case it was
necessary for the response to

485
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:12,720
COVID.
Fitz.

486
00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:18,200
That's all fascinating because
then it makes me wonder why did

487
00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:21,560
we move to positive pressure?
Because it seemed there's got to

488
00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:23,160
be benefits.
I mean, I trust science, you

489
00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:27,800
know, and obviously we're not
using iron lungs in our IC, us

490
00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:32,400
in, in U.S. hospitals.
But I'm very curious as to why

491
00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:35,640
we switched.
I'm very curious what the added

492
00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:38,240
benefit is, I guess.
And it might just be space,

493
00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:39,160
right?
I don't know.

494
00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:43,600
But that's what I got, that's
what I got from it is a space

495
00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:47,000
thing, because these iron lines
are pretty huge and it's not

496
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:48,520
that.
As big as the human that's in

497
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:49,640
them, right?
Right.

498
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:52,200
And it's not that it's bigger
than a bed, but also when you

499
00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:58,160
think of the body needs, the
iron lung made that difficult at

500
00:25:58,160 --> 00:26:00,000
best.
And there was a time where they

501
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:02,360
tried larger room size iron
lungs.

502
00:26:02,360 --> 00:26:06,840
That way they can have multiple
patients in it and each one

503
00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:08,800
this.
I didn't see a picture of it,

504
00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:11,880
but I'd really like to.
But each person had their head

505
00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:15,600
hanging out.
So I I just envisioned this box

506
00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:16,880
with heads hanging out of it.
Yeah.

507
00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:19,560
And what was good about it,
though, is several.

508
00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:21,120
Patients that you break in half
there?

509
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:25,480
You go and but what was good
about it is that several

510
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:26,920
patients could be in the same
space.

511
00:26:26,920 --> 00:26:30,880
So that did save some space and
also nurses and respiratory

512
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,840
therapists could be inside the
seal room taking care of the

513
00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:36,680
patients.
So, OK, how does this compare to

514
00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:39,520
a negative pressure room in the
hospital that we use for

515
00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:42,800
tuberculosis?
Because I think the negative

516
00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:46,520
pressure in that situation
remains negative the whole time.

517
00:26:47,080 --> 00:26:50,240
And in this case the the
pressure will vary.

518
00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:54,120
The negative pressure there
keeps things from leaving the

519
00:26:54,120 --> 00:26:56,680
space.
In an iron lung, there's a

520
00:26:56,680 --> 00:26:59,400
variation of pressure so that
the lungs will expand and

521
00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:02,880
contract or the diaphragm will
expand and contract, and that's

522
00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:04,320
where it went.
Fascinating.

523
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:08,320
And and so I think about the.
Larger room size, iron lungs.

524
00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:11,560
So I would imagine the person
working there would have to go

525
00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:13,880
in and stay in.
It's not like you can pop in and

526
00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:16,480
out, right, Right.
And then how does that feel to

527
00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:18,120
someone who is actually
breathing?

528
00:27:18,120 --> 00:27:19,640
Does it make breathing
difficult?

529
00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:23,160
Does it do do I would think that
I would start breathing at the

530
00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:27,600
rate that whatever they decided
was the rate and that feel, I

531
00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:30,640
think that would feel really
unpleasant because what if I

532
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:32,720
really want to breathe right
now, but I can't because the

533
00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:36,560
pressure is such that I can't?
I don't know there there are a

534
00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:38,800
lot of rabbit holes that could
have gone down, but I don't

535
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:41,200
think anyone wants to hear me
talk for a week at a time.

536
00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:43,720
So I decided not to do all of
that.

537
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:46,680
It's really interesting though.
So if you're if you like

538
00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:49,080
learning more about this,
there's a lot of a lot of

539
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:52,080
information on the Internet,
which also surprised me because

540
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:56,320
I know I want such an old topic
nobody who cares, but apparently

541
00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:59,800
AI found out I do care.
Also knowing that my great great

542
00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:07,120
uncle was in one for a time, but
I just the whole situation seems

543
00:28:07,120 --> 00:28:09,720
untenable to me.
Agreed.

544
00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:13,160
But I mean that are dying I
guess was the choice at the

545
00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:18,360
point again polio is it's either
paralytic or non paralytic.

546
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:22,200
And that I didn't realize I
thought all polio was paralytic,

547
00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:25,680
which means paralyzed.
And for those who are not

548
00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:28,920
familiar with that word.
But apparently the symptoms of

549
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:32,800
non paralytic polio would be
easy to mix up with something

550
00:28:32,800 --> 00:28:37,040
else because their symptoms
usually last about 10 days and

551
00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:39,960
the symptoms can include fever,
sore throat, headache, vomiting,

552
00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:43,880
fatigue, back pain and more.
OK, so that sounds like

553
00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:48,000
everything right?
How would you I think that was

554
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:50,360
discovered.
And this is this is thoughts by

555
00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:52,200
Andrea.
I don't know this for a fact,

556
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:56,000
but I'm wondering if they knew
about the paralytic polio and

557
00:28:56,000 --> 00:29:00,080
then they saw the non paralytic,
which had similar, similar sorts

558
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:05,840
of illness things going on, but
it didn't have the paralysis or

559
00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:07,960
sometimes it was temporary
paralysis.

560
00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:10,520
But these symptoms could be
almost anything.

561
00:29:10,840 --> 00:29:15,760
I mean, so who knows.
But the part that this iron lung

562
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:19,800
was for was the paralytic polio.
And that is the most critical

563
00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:23,560
form of polio and that it has
similar symptoms.

564
00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:25,800
But after a week or so, other
effects take place.

565
00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:28,920
So this was news to me too,
because I thought you get polio,

566
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:31,040
you get paralyzed, you either
die or you don't die.

567
00:29:32,120 --> 00:29:34,520
That's what I knew about polio,
Which.

568
00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:37,280
Is Frank and Franklin Delaware
Roosevelt had polio?

569
00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:39,120
I know that, right?
And we'll talk about that in a

570
00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:40,520
little bit in a few minutes,
too.

571
00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:43,840
I thought back back in the dark
ages when I went into nursing

572
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:45,680
school.
I don't even really remember

573
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:47,720
talking a lot about polio.
Do you?

574
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:51,160
We only talk about vaccines.
Yeah, yeah, 'cause I mean, your,

575
00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:55,840
your nursing experience is much
more recent than mine, but it's

576
00:29:55,840 --> 00:30:00,520
just, I had no idea.
At any rate, surprise, surprise,

577
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:07,800
the paralytic part of the polio
is after the initial 10 days

578
00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:12,400
when people start developing
other things in addition to the

579
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:15,800
symptoms we talked about before.
The body loses its reflex, the

580
00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:19,520
limbs go, this was in the
article, loose and floppy,

581
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:23,440
that's what it was called.
And severe muscle aches occur.

582
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:27,720
So, dear listeners, viruses are
insidious.

583
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:31,560
I implore you, don't mess around
with viruses.

584
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:34,560
That's all I'm going to say.
They I mean, you saw it in

585
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:35,680
COVID.
I said, that's all I'm going to

586
00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:36,880
say.
And then I'm saying more, but

587
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:39,720
saw it in COVID.
Think about all the different

588
00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:41,480
symptoms that different people
had.

589
00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:45,280
There were probably, you know,
there's probably a list of 100

590
00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:48,520
symptoms and most people got
four or five or six of them,

591
00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:52,400
right?
So I'm just just hearing all of

592
00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:55,440
these possibilities with this
polio virus as well.

593
00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:59,560
It's like, Oh my goodness,
viruses are just so insidious.

594
00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:03,640
Yeah, and it it brings back to
me a memory of nursing school

595
00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:06,440
when they'd ask us what are the
side effects of medication?

596
00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:09,600
We can say nausea, vomiting and
dizziness to almost all of them.

597
00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:13,400
And it got to the IT got to the
point where our instructor said

598
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:14,920
you cannot list those three
things.

599
00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:18,400
We know that's probably a side
effect of everything medication.

600
00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:23,160
Now you have to think outside
the box and point about a virus.

601
00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:25,720
You know, a lot of times we say,
well, it's just a virus and

602
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:28,200
we're not saying rush to the
hospital for every possible

603
00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:30,840
thing you have.
If you know your body, know

604
00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:34,400
what's different.
And if something lasts for any

605
00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:36,000
period of time.
And I'm not going to put a day

606
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:39,200
on it because this is outside of
what I want to deal with in the

607
00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:42,520
scope of this podcast.
But if you're concerned, get it

608
00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:45,320
checked out.
Really, it's really important.

609
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:49,240
So back to polio.
After the limbs go loose and

610
00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:54,120
floppy air quotes and the severe
muscle aches occur, the prowess

611
00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:56,840
impacts the patient's ability to
breathe on their own.

612
00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:03,160
Now a lot of the polio paralysis
is other parts of the body, and

613
00:32:03,160 --> 00:32:06,880
that's not great, but breathing,
of course, is.

614
00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:11,400
Is great.
I know it's not not overrated.

615
00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:16,800
And that's one of the things
that is the big worry is that

616
00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:20,240
people will stop breathing.
They will typically, from what I

617
00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:22,360
read, they would struggle to
breathe on their own.

618
00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:25,280
So it wasn't, again, it wasn't
one of those things that I got

619
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:28,000
polio one day and the next day I
was paralyzed, couldn't breathe.

620
00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:29,880
It was a progressive sort of
thing.

621
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,360
And I imagine that must be based
on the viral load or, or

622
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:35,960
whatever is going on because of
the struggle.

623
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:40,880
You know, they had to get into
the iron lung or, or something

624
00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:44,160
else that could assist them.
If it wasn't too bad, they could

625
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:46,880
just have oxygen.
But the worst of them did have

626
00:32:46,880 --> 00:32:51,520
to go into this iron lung.
And what's interesting too is it

627
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:54,760
didn't have impact only on the
people that were in the iron

628
00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:59,320
lung because there was a whole
societal change because of it.

629
00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:02,800
One of the things that it did
do, and we'll talk, I keep

630
00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:04,720
saying we'll talk more about
this because we will talk more

631
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:08,640
about this.
But some of the more well known

632
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:13,680
people who have polio, like FDR,
yes, brought it to the

633
00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:16,240
forefront.
So with that and some of the

634
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:20,400
other more famous cases, the
awareness of disability rights

635
00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:26,320
was brought to the forefront and
it helped even the the field for

636
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,680
people who are disabled.
And we know right now, many,

637
00:33:29,680 --> 00:33:32,920
many years later, it's still not
anywhere close to even.

638
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:35,400
But it's when some of the, some
of the people who had

639
00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:39,000
disabilities were actually able
to come out and be seen where

640
00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:43,000
prior to this, a lot of times
people with disabilities were

641
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:46,320
just hidden away and and not
right and not address.

642
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:49,480
And what's shocking about that
to me thing is the people with

643
00:33:49,480 --> 00:33:52,280
disabilities, it's not like they
did it in most cases anyway.

644
00:33:52,560 --> 00:33:54,160
I mean, it's like they were born
that way.

645
00:33:54,160 --> 00:33:57,640
And how can they be treated
poorly, as if somehow it was

646
00:33:57,640 --> 00:34:01,240
contagious or something.
I that just, that just doesn't

647
00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:04,120
make sense to me.
But anyway, so it did help get

648
00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:07,720
this idea of people with
disabilities having value.

649
00:34:07,720 --> 00:34:11,080
One of the things when it says I
just have to read this because

650
00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:15,679
it was funny to me, ironically
funny. 1 downside the iron lung

651
00:34:15,679 --> 00:34:19,040
was how inaccessible it was to
the patients body like we talked

652
00:34:19,040 --> 00:34:23,679
about, right, right.
So it that pushed innovation for

653
00:34:23,679 --> 00:34:26,480
other things again because of
that.

654
00:34:26,679 --> 00:34:29,600
And that's when the use and
development of mechanical

655
00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:31,600
ventilators and things like that
started.

656
00:34:31,679 --> 00:34:34,480
These ventilators were not very
popular.

657
00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:37,199
The other kinds that weren't
iron lungs, they weren't very

658
00:34:37,199 --> 00:34:39,520
popular.
Nobody really was totally sure.

659
00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:42,760
But before polio, it just hadn't
become a thing.

660
00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:46,520
And maybe, well, I can't even
say why, but it was practically

661
00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:48,600
an overlook.
And guess if you want to.

662
00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:51,560
I think, sure, I'm good at
guessing and making up wild

663
00:34:51,560 --> 00:34:54,920
facts, why not?
But the treatment of the

664
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:58,200
ventilators was, it was really
an overlooked medical

665
00:34:58,200 --> 00:35:02,880
breakthrough for some reason.
But once polio and the iron lung

666
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:05,160
started being used, they were
looking at options.

667
00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:07,200
And these ventilators were
useful.

668
00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:11,600
And one predecessor to the
ventilators that we use now was

669
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:17,320
called the Thunberg
barrowsbarator brassbarator.

670
00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:19,880
I'm probably saying that very
wrong.

671
00:35:19,880 --> 00:35:22,320
It sounds wrong.
Anyway, something along that

672
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:26,200
line and it fully encased the
head and body.

673
00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:27,880
See, this would be a problem for
me.

674
00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:32,000
That's just.
Being buried alive, right?

675
00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:36,520
And there was limited clinical
success as well.

676
00:35:36,520 --> 00:35:41,680
So that didn't stick, which I,
Oh my gosh, I just think of that

677
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:47,640
going, how could, how could that
even, I don't understand even

678
00:35:47,640 --> 00:35:51,720
how that could happen.
But there was, there were a lot

679
00:35:51,720 --> 00:35:54,960
of things that move towards the
full controlled ventilation and

680
00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:57,680
partial ventilation support.
And we're not going to go into

681
00:35:57,680 --> 00:36:00,960
that particularly today because
there's a lot about it.

682
00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:04,680
But just know that the iron lung
and the ventilator were both

683
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:07,120
available.
Iron lung hung out for a while

684
00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:09,680
and then people developed
ventilators that were the

685
00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:14,800
predecessors to what we use now.
And back to your comment about

686
00:36:14,880 --> 00:36:18,720
why was 1 better than the other.
And, and a lot of it, like I

687
00:36:18,720 --> 00:36:22,920
say, was because in the iron
lung, the people were isolated

688
00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:26,080
from their surroundings because
they're totally encased in a

689
00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:29,080
machine.
And they also.

690
00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:32,600
Rolling down the rolling down
the street on a walk, right.

691
00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:35,680
Actually, what's funny is the
guy who lived in the longest,

692
00:36:35,680 --> 00:36:40,040
We'll talk about that.
Yeah, but one of the things that

693
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:43,320
was a problem is because it
wasn't only difficult to breathe

694
00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:47,240
or people weren't only and some
people were completely incapable

695
00:36:47,240 --> 00:36:51,000
of breathing, they also had the
inability to eat, swallow and

696
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:54,040
talk.
So imagine being in a

697
00:36:54,040 --> 00:36:58,880
ventilator, I mean a iron lung,
you can't eat, swallow or talk

698
00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:01,480
and you're stuck in there and
people are trying to feed.

699
00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:04,760
And there's a lot of like my, my
great uncle, his name was Daddy

700
00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:07,200
Guy.
He had a nasogastric tube, which

701
00:37:07,600 --> 00:37:12,040
I would rather have that than
risk eating and choking to death

702
00:37:12,640 --> 00:37:16,240
because that obviously having a
choking incident would be a huge

703
00:37:16,240 --> 00:37:19,080
problem.
One of the things is they

704
00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:22,480
mentioned is that patients had
to relearn the basic abilities

705
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:26,080
to eat, talk, swallow after
they've been in the iron lung

706
00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:29,720
for a while.
One patient here said that she

707
00:37:30,240 --> 00:37:32,560
she was talking about her
experience in the iron lung and

708
00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:35,800
she said, quote, I used to sit
up perhaps to have a cup of tea,

709
00:37:35,800 --> 00:37:37,200
but then would have to keep an
eye.

710
00:37:37,240 --> 00:37:40,080
They'd have to be keep an eye on
me because my fingers would go

711
00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:42,760
blue and in about 15 minutes, I
would have to go back in.

712
00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:44,240
Wow.
Yeah.

713
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:49,800
So she, I don't see her name.
They didn't put it in here

714
00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:52,560
anywhere that I could see.
But it said that she had to

715
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:55,080
practically live in the iron
lung for a while.

716
00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:59,120
As we mentioned, it made them
feel trapped, which, of course.

717
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:02,800
And she said that most people
were just waiting until the

718
00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:06,680
escape the iron lung.
One story that was published in

719
00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:10,480
The Washington Post talks about
a person who was 19 years old,

720
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:13,360
bold and paralyzed.
After she was in the in the iron

721
00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:16,040
lung for about 13 hours a day
for months.

722
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:20,160
She was allowed to come out for
about 12 hours and then started

723
00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:24,360
having a air quote, normal life.
That's the difficulty with these

724
00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:27,880
things, especially polio.
Go ahead where you can say

725
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:30,320
something.
I just you, you're in the iron

726
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:34,200
lung for months and then you're
you're let out for 12 hours and

727
00:38:34,200 --> 00:38:36,240
then you go back in.
That seems like a really long

728
00:38:36,240 --> 00:38:39,760
time to be unsupported.
Well, and people would build up

729
00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:41,200
to that.
We'll talk a little bit about

730
00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:43,600
that when we talk about the
individual people.

731
00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:45,960
And they, and so they would
build up their tolerance for

732
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:48,240
breathing and some could build
it up to the point that they

733
00:38:48,240 --> 00:38:50,080
could be out of their iron lung
altogether.

734
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:52,960
A lot of people like these two
people could build it up to a

735
00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:55,560
degree.
And then the problem is, is that

736
00:38:55,600 --> 00:39:00,160
because of their paralysis, the
breathing effort was so huge

737
00:39:00,560 --> 00:39:02,080
that they would just become
exhausted.

738
00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:04,760
So they could no longer continue
to breathe because they had to

739
00:39:04,760 --> 00:39:07,480
create the breathing that it
wasn't just their body doing it.

740
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:10,480
They had to do things.
And we'll talk about this person

741
00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:15,960
Paul here in a minute and how he
learned to breathe himself.

742
00:39:15,960 --> 00:39:21,200
Like we said about polio, it's
such a huge problem related to

743
00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:23,200
the breathing.
And because of being in these

744
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:25,800
iron lungs or even being, not
having one of those chest ones

745
00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:29,200
or, or even a ventilator, it
would just take a toll on the

746
00:39:29,200 --> 00:39:32,640
person psychologically.
And there was nothing, nothing

747
00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:36,320
about an iron lung that was
pleasant that I could see they

748
00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:39,760
also.
Then why is daddy guy smiling

749
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:41,720
and is that?
Right, that's right.

750
00:39:42,680 --> 00:39:46,440
Good question.
And also the with this feeling

751
00:39:46,440 --> 00:39:51,080
of isolation, they often felt
hopeless and and very scared.

752
00:39:51,080 --> 00:39:55,160
And the people outside the iron
lung couldn't really do anything

753
00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:57,360
about it either.
They could talk to them, they

754
00:39:57,360 --> 00:40:01,560
could support them.
The iron lung device came with a

755
00:40:01,560 --> 00:40:04,920
head support, which as I looked
at it, looked intensely

756
00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:07,400
uncomfortable.
I mean, have you ever been?

757
00:40:07,480 --> 00:40:09,600
In the same place for a while
and not been able to move.

758
00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:12,840
Yes, it sucks.
Well no actually because my body

759
00:40:13,400 --> 00:40:16,280
moves me anyway, right?
Like I'm because I'm not

760
00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:19,520
paralyzed, I autonomically move
so.

761
00:40:19,880 --> 00:40:22,440
But yes, I have felt
uncomfortable enough even to

762
00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:25,320
move right.
Well, so I can't imagine.

763
00:40:25,840 --> 00:40:29,000
No, it would be awful.
And one of the things they had

764
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:32,600
us doing in nursing school is
they gave us assignment for a

765
00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:36,800
homework and they said go home
and for two hours find find a

766
00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:39,360
really comfortable position, a
place you really like, somewhere

767
00:40:39,360 --> 00:40:42,920
you're super comfortable and lie
there for two hours without

768
00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:44,680
moving.
Just don't move at all.

769
00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:46,960
You can't move no matter what.
You can't move.

770
00:40:47,120 --> 00:40:49,520
Obviously we could, but just
don't.

771
00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:52,040
And so I thought, OK, I'm going
to get a really comfortable

772
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:55,080
place.
I got into the love Sack Big

773
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:57,840
Bean pillow and I thought this
is going to be great.

774
00:40:57,840 --> 00:41:01,120
And besides, I thought the the
whole pillow and stuff would

775
00:41:01,120 --> 00:41:03,520
just move around a little and I
wouldn't be moving, but it'd be

776
00:41:03,520 --> 00:41:04,760
moving me.
So that would be good.

777
00:41:05,160 --> 00:41:09,000
And I was in there for probably
15 minutes and I'm going, Oh my

778
00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:11,680
gosh, I want to move.
And do you know why they chose

779
00:41:11,680 --> 00:41:16,040
the two hours?
Probably because that's when the

780
00:41:16,040 --> 00:41:20,320
skin starts to break down well.
That historically was the amount

781
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:23,200
of time we could let someone lay
in the same position without

782
00:41:23,200 --> 00:41:26,320
moving them.
Because back in the day we had

783
00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:28,960
no, we had no air baffles in the
beds.

784
00:41:28,960 --> 00:41:30,600
We didn't have any rotation of
the beds.

785
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:33,800
It was just a bed.
So we, we move them every two

786
00:41:33,800 --> 00:41:36,720
hours at minimum.
We could move them more, but two

787
00:41:36,720 --> 00:41:39,920
hours was mandatory because as
you say, it would start to break

788
00:41:39,920 --> 00:41:41,320
down and plus just felt
terrible.

789
00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:45,560
So I was lying there for two
hours in what I felt was a super

790
00:41:45,560 --> 00:41:48,000
comfortable position and it
became awful.

791
00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:51,720
And that was a good position.
It wasn't a hard hospital bed,

792
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:56,120
plastic under me and sheets that
were 12 thread count instead of,

793
00:41:56,320 --> 00:42:00,840
you know, 500.
That was that was interesting to

794
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:03,200
me too, because.
Potentially laying in your own

795
00:42:03,200 --> 00:42:04,440
urine.
Just had to throw that out

796
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:05,160
there.
Sure.

797
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:08,360
And whatever else was going on,
wounds and all of that.

798
00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:11,360
Yeah, exactly.
So just I just imagine the

799
00:42:11,360 --> 00:42:13,480
psychological aspects of this is
just.

800
00:42:13,520 --> 00:42:16,120
I just can't.
One of the other things too is

801
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:18,920
with the iron lung, the body
isn't able to be dependent on

802
00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:22,040
its own.
The body will would start

803
00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:25,720
depending on the machine to
actually create the breathing.

804
00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:28,720
And that's another reason why
they started to let people out

805
00:42:28,720 --> 00:42:31,720
for a period of time so they
could maintain the ability to

806
00:42:31,720 --> 00:42:34,000
breathe.
But even still, like we talked

807
00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:37,240
about before, if I could
partially breathe and get put

808
00:42:37,240 --> 00:42:39,960
back in the iron lung and it
made me breathe when I didn't

809
00:42:39,960 --> 00:42:42,480
want to, that seems like that
would be difficult as well.

810
00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:45,120
So there's just not.
It was a great scenario because

811
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:48,480
it saved lives, but just seems
so horrid.

812
00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:53,200
And one of the things, one of
the things about polio that is

813
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:56,680
important to remember is that it
didn't affect just adults,

814
00:42:56,680 --> 00:42:59,400
right?
It affected just all people who

815
00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:02,520
got it it.
It was non discriminatory.

816
00:43:02,520 --> 00:43:05,840
Every age was affected.
And so children would get polio

817
00:43:06,240 --> 00:43:09,240
and they had to get into these
iron lungs.

818
00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:13,800
But children are supposed to be
developing in their brains, in

819
00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:15,240
their bodies, and everything
else.

820
00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:20,560
Right, and exploring.
Sure, so polio made them not be

821
00:43:20,560 --> 00:43:24,080
able to move, but their bodies
still had needs and things like

822
00:43:24,080 --> 00:43:26,680
that for growing, and their
minds did too.

823
00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:29,880
So it took quite a while for
people to figure out how to

824
00:43:29,880 --> 00:43:33,280
educate children in iron lung
because it's not like they could

825
00:43:33,280 --> 00:43:36,160
write down homework assignments.
They can't go to school, they

826
00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:39,080
can't do of those things.
So there were a lot of teachers

827
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:42,640
that got together to try and
help teach children and give

828
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:45,840
them the appropriate mental
development and stimulation so

829
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:49,480
that they weren't stunted when
or if they got out of this iron

830
00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:51,440
lung.
Some of the techniques that they

831
00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:54,000
developed involved.
I saw one child who's in the

832
00:43:54,000 --> 00:43:55,840
iron lung.
He looked like he was probably

833
00:43:56,360 --> 00:43:58,720
probably about 8 or 9.
Hard to tell just by his head

834
00:43:58,720 --> 00:44:00,200
but.
That looked about.

835
00:44:00,200 --> 00:44:03,400
That age to me.
And he had a paintbrush in his

836
00:44:03,400 --> 00:44:05,160
mouth and he was painting a
picture.

837
00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:06,840
Oh, wow.
I know.

838
00:44:06,840 --> 00:44:09,800
What they found is with the
different strategies for

839
00:44:09,800 --> 00:44:12,600
teaching these children and
trying to assist them to thrive

840
00:44:12,600 --> 00:44:17,800
as much as humanly possible,
they had to do easy projects

841
00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:20,680
that didn't involve moving the
arms or legs.

842
00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:23,640
Can you imagine how difficult it
was to engage a student when

843
00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:26,440
they're just lying there?
No, I cannot.

844
00:44:27,000 --> 00:44:29,800
And then you've got people who
couldn't talk also don't even

845
00:44:29,800 --> 00:44:32,800
know what they're learning.
But they worked real hard to do

846
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:36,920
that and they tried to get the
kids to participate in

847
00:44:36,920 --> 00:44:39,960
activities, but there's not a
whole lot of person can do from

848
00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:42,520
an iron tongue.
They just the best solution they

849
00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:45,120
felt like they came up with was
teaching the children how to

850
00:44:45,240 --> 00:44:48,400
form a task.
So they teach them and

851
00:44:49,080 --> 00:44:53,080
potentially just in verbal
instruction and then have that

852
00:44:53,160 --> 00:44:56,480
student teach someone else.
They could see if they learned

853
00:44:56,480 --> 00:44:59,320
it by teaching it by the chain,
right?

854
00:44:59,320 --> 00:45:01,160
Right.
To me, it just says that they

855
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:04,200
knew how to memorize things.
But I don't know if it helped,

856
00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:09,120
but they tried really hard.
And they also, they also were

857
00:45:09,320 --> 00:45:12,960
surprisingly talking about
emotions that children have

858
00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:17,200
because, you know, a kid isn't
going to understand as well as

859
00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:19,520
an adult why the heck they have
to be in this tube.

860
00:45:19,680 --> 00:45:23,360
How scary it must have been.
They did address some of that as

861
00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:27,760
much as they could, but they
said one of the issues is that

862
00:45:27,760 --> 00:45:31,560
these kids could be OK and then
their emotions would be all over

863
00:45:31,560 --> 00:45:35,320
the map during the whole day.
And that was for the teachers

864
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:38,960
too, because at 1 moment they
could be super engaged and other

865
00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:41,640
other moments they could be sad,
crying, yelling, all of that

866
00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:44,680
sort of thing.
And through no fault of their

867
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:45,600
own.
I mean, they were just

868
00:45:46,160 --> 00:45:48,760
frustrated.
And as a child, they had fewer

869
00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:52,440
tools to deal with the
difficulties than an adult did.

870
00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:55,080
And.
I have two similar scenarios to

871
00:45:55,080 --> 00:45:57,480
that, and they're not, obviously
they're not an iron lung, but

872
00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:02,080
first one is when Odyssey was 20
months old, 20, she had her

873
00:46:02,080 --> 00:46:04,520
tonsils out because she was
having chronic strep throat.

874
00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:11,240
And she was so young that I
couldn't get her to drink any

875
00:46:11,240 --> 00:46:12,520
anything.
I couldn't get her to drink

876
00:46:12,520 --> 00:46:13,840
anything because her throat
hurt, right?

877
00:46:14,200 --> 00:46:16,680
And she was so young that I, I
couldn't reason with her.

878
00:46:16,840 --> 00:46:19,360
There was no way to say to a 20
month old, if you don't drink

879
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:20,800
something right now, you're
going to have to go to the

880
00:46:20,800 --> 00:46:23,080
hospital and get a needle put
into you and you know, get IV

881
00:46:23,720 --> 00:46:25,520
fluids.
Yeah, that would make a

882
00:46:25,560 --> 00:46:27,360
difference, would it?
Yeah, exactly.

883
00:46:27,360 --> 00:46:30,960
And so I mean, obviously those
obviously, but we did not end up

884
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:33,520
having to go to the hospital.
She finally, on the last day,

885
00:46:33,520 --> 00:46:35,880
she finally drank something last
day before she would have had to

886
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:37,320
go.
And then the other scenario is

887
00:46:37,320 --> 00:46:40,200
when Kira was about, I want to
say six months old.

888
00:46:40,880 --> 00:46:42,880
I got to be honest, my memory
about these kinds of things

889
00:46:42,880 --> 00:46:46,000
isn't good.
So if this is medically not

890
00:46:46,000 --> 00:46:48,080
right, shush when.
She was about 6.

891
00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:51,640
Months old she had, she had a
crooked head.

892
00:46:51,640 --> 00:46:54,040
I can't think of what it's
called, but she needed a helmet.

893
00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:56,480
I always want to say
hydrocephaly, which is not, it's

894
00:46:56,760 --> 00:46:59,800
hydrocephaly is way worse, but
it is something.

895
00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:01,360
Seth played geocephaly.
There we go.

896
00:47:01,560 --> 00:47:04,720
She had played geocephaly, which
basically means that your face,

897
00:47:05,800 --> 00:47:08,200
in her case, it meant that her
twin was sitting on top of her

898
00:47:08,200 --> 00:47:10,440
and smooshed her skull and made
it misshapen, right.

899
00:47:10,840 --> 00:47:12,640
So she had to get a helmet about
six months old.

900
00:47:13,200 --> 00:47:16,720
Well, she fought the whole
plastering process and fought

901
00:47:16,960 --> 00:47:19,840
getting the helmet on every time
for the nine months that she had

902
00:47:19,840 --> 00:47:21,880
it.
And I couldn't explain to her

903
00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:26,320
why she had to have it, right.
Like it just, it is what it is.

904
00:47:26,320 --> 00:47:29,680
And so, you know, you think
about these are non verbal kids

905
00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:31,400
or pre verbal kids, I should
say.

906
00:47:31,400 --> 00:47:34,040
But still, even when they're
verbal, they may not necessarily

907
00:47:34,040 --> 00:47:35,880
know what they're feeling or
they may not necessarily

908
00:47:35,880 --> 00:47:37,880
understand the explanation that
you're giving them.

909
00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:43,560
And so it's it, it's very like,
it's heartbreaking, frankly.

910
00:47:44,880 --> 00:47:48,480
Yeah.
And, and it, it makes it such a

911
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:52,680
challenge and like you say, with
even these kids, the ones that

912
00:47:52,680 --> 00:47:56,360
they talked about were a little
bit older at the at the school,

913
00:47:56,880 --> 00:48:00,280
but they're, I wonder if they
don't talk about younger

914
00:48:00,280 --> 00:48:02,600
children because maybe they
didn't survive it.

915
00:48:03,360 --> 00:48:04,040
True.
Maybe not.

916
00:48:04,400 --> 00:48:08,360
And I'm, that's what I was
thinking when I, when I saw the

917
00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:12,440
evidence they were talking about
with the way people responded to

918
00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:14,800
it.
So I'm not really sure, but it

919
00:48:14,800 --> 00:48:17,200
is very difficult.
One of the things that they

920
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:20,800
talked about is as the new
medical technology accelerated,

921
00:48:21,240 --> 00:48:27,760
there was a term that was called
the iron, iron lung, which was

922
00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:32,080
not, it was sort of referring to
the iron lung itself, but it was

923
00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:35,840
more describing a, the
entrapment and claustrophobic

924
00:48:35,840 --> 00:48:39,800
nature of the machine.
And it had the effect it had on

925
00:48:39,800 --> 00:48:43,640
people for the rest of their
lives, even after they were out

926
00:48:43,640 --> 00:48:46,400
of the iron lung.
And I wouldn't be surprised if

927
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:50,600
people had what we would call
now PTSD from it because the

928
00:48:50,600 --> 00:48:53,200
whole experience must have been
most unpleasant.

929
00:48:53,240 --> 00:48:56,960
As you mentioned, Franklin
Delano Roosevelt was a victim of

930
00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:01,520
polio initially.
There is some evidence that most

931
00:49:01,520 --> 00:49:06,080
people believe that his
diagnosis was kept hidden

932
00:49:06,520 --> 00:49:09,760
because they didn't want
everyone to know that the

933
00:49:09,760 --> 00:49:14,720
president was in trouble and
there was some reporter.

934
00:49:14,720 --> 00:49:17,200
Did he contract it as president?
I.

935
00:49:17,840 --> 00:49:20,280
Didn't know that.
There was a reporter apparently

936
00:49:20,280 --> 00:49:24,000
in the White House and the
secret surface that would take

937
00:49:24,000 --> 00:49:28,160
pictures that made him look like
he was OK and but they didn't

938
00:49:28,160 --> 00:49:31,400
want him and to be in a date and
disabled or weakened state,

939
00:49:31,400 --> 00:49:34,080
which obviously was easier than
would it be now.

940
00:49:34,440 --> 00:49:37,560
And it talked about how the
disabled were not always

941
00:49:37,560 --> 00:49:43,000
respected, as we discussed.
And FDR was part of a air quote

942
00:49:43,000 --> 00:49:45,800
group that was often looked down
upon.

943
00:49:45,840 --> 00:49:50,280
His ability to change how people
saw the disabled was impeccable,

944
00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:53,960
they say, because he became a
single signal of strength and

945
00:49:53,960 --> 00:49:58,280
perseverance and his problem and
his disabilities.

946
00:49:58,600 --> 00:50:01,200
So I.
Don't know, sorry, I don't know

947
00:50:01,200 --> 00:50:04,480
anything about his politics, but
he he has a warm part in my

948
00:50:04,480 --> 00:50:08,560
heart like because specifically
because he was in a wheelchair

949
00:50:08,560 --> 00:50:11,440
and I had a great uncle who was
in a wheelchair who would take

950
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:14,320
us.
He was the fun uncle right for

951
00:50:14,320 --> 00:50:17,720
wheelchair rides and like put us
on his lap and spin around, do

952
00:50:18,080 --> 00:50:22,120
do tricks and and so whatever I
think of FDRII have like I said,

953
00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:23,320
I have no idea what his
politics.

954
00:50:23,360 --> 00:50:25,640
I mean, I know about the New
Deal and stuff, but I don't

955
00:50:25,640 --> 00:50:28,760
know, you know, I don't know his
character per SE, but I was, to

956
00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:30,360
me, he's also like the fun
grandpa.

957
00:50:30,360 --> 00:50:33,840
He's the fun Grandpa president.
The fun Grandpa president.

958
00:50:33,840 --> 00:50:34,960
I like that.
That's good.

959
00:50:35,360 --> 00:50:39,000
Well, then one of the things
that was fun to learn to me was

960
00:50:39,000 --> 00:50:43,240
that his connection to the
handicap pushed him to do the

961
00:50:43,240 --> 00:50:46,880
fundraiser for.
You'll recognize part of this,

962
00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:51,400
the Franklin Roosevelt found
Roosevelt Foundation of March of

963
00:50:51,400 --> 00:50:52,480
Dimes.
Nice.

964
00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:55,160
Yeah.
And and I thought that was

965
00:50:55,160 --> 00:50:58,600
awesome that the Roosevelt
family started that as the

966
00:50:58,600 --> 00:51:02,040
epidemic of polio increased.
FDR.

967
00:51:02,360 --> 00:51:06,000
Really turn to the public to
fundraise, to learn what to do

968
00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:09,600
about it, how to do vaccines and
rehabilitation for the survivor.

969
00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:11,600
And as I mentioned, that was
called the March of Dimes.

970
00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:15,120
And most of us have probably
heard about that one way or

971
00:51:15,120 --> 00:51:16,960
another.
Jerry Lewis, I think, was the

972
00:51:16,960 --> 00:51:18,320
one who did the March, wasn't
he?

973
00:51:18,400 --> 00:51:21,200
March of Dimes.
Yeah, That might be that might

974
00:51:21,200 --> 00:51:24,200
be too far before your time.
No, no, no, I know what Jerry

975
00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:25,400
Lewis is.
I'm trying to remember if it was

976
00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:27,560
March of Dimes.
I was thinking it was I could be

977
00:51:27,560 --> 00:51:30,400
incorrect on that.
And listeners, if I am, please

978
00:51:30,680 --> 00:51:34,120
just put a note, a comment in
our yeah comment section.

979
00:51:34,120 --> 00:51:36,760
I I can't think.
Of I can't think of another

980
00:51:36,760 --> 00:51:38,720
option, so I'm just going to
agree with you for now.

981
00:51:39,560 --> 00:51:42,840
Yeah, that's how I remember it,
but I could be totally wrong

982
00:51:42,880 --> 00:51:44,680
anyway.
You know, I know about the March

983
00:51:44,680 --> 00:51:48,120
of Dimes free address.
Labels, baby.

984
00:51:50,080 --> 00:51:52,120
That's Yep, you know, everything
has a hook.

985
00:51:52,400 --> 00:51:54,280
That's right.
The hook was the labels.

986
00:51:54,560 --> 00:51:57,640
But the March of Dimes was
developed in 1938.

987
00:51:57,720 --> 00:52:01,840
I don't know of any other large
fundraiser prior to that.

988
00:52:01,840 --> 00:52:03,480
That doesn't mean it wasn't
there, but I just don't know

989
00:52:03,560 --> 00:52:05,800
know about it.
So it actually the foundation

990
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:08,720
contributed to innovation and
the advancements in the iron

991
00:52:08,720 --> 00:52:11,840
lung.
So without FDR's participation,

992
00:52:11,840 --> 00:52:14,600
the iron lung.
Jerry Lewis's muscular

993
00:52:14,600 --> 00:52:16,000
dystrophy.
Thank you.

994
00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:19,600
Correction made.
And so that was something that I

995
00:52:19,600 --> 00:52:23,520
remember as a child watching the
Jerry Lewis telethons and that

996
00:52:23,520 --> 00:52:26,080
was the only time we got to
spend stay up overnight for some

997
00:52:26,080 --> 00:52:28,240
reason because our parents
supported it.

998
00:52:28,240 --> 00:52:30,560
I guess I don't really remember.
I just.

999
00:52:31,000 --> 00:52:33,480
I forgot that it went overnight,
went 24 hours or however.

1000
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:37,520
Yeah, I remember at the end of
it, he was so tired every time.

1001
00:52:37,680 --> 00:52:41,960
So, yeah.
But this FD Rs contribution to

1002
00:52:42,440 --> 00:52:45,920
the advocacy of disabled people
was huge.

1003
00:52:46,320 --> 00:52:50,280
There was a person who had a big
influence on disability rights

1004
00:52:50,400 --> 00:52:55,560
as well during the during the
polio disease part.

1005
00:52:55,880 --> 00:52:58,840
And his name was Mark O'Brien.
And he was 6 when he was

1006
00:52:58,840 --> 00:53:02,520
diagnosed with polio, and it was
so severe that he needed this

1007
00:53:02,720 --> 00:53:04,960
assistive respiration operators
for the rest of his life.

1008
00:53:05,680 --> 00:53:12,040
And as we talked about, he lived
in an iron lung and his tank had

1009
00:53:12,040 --> 00:53:16,600
a movable mattress that gave it
the more enduring nickname of

1010
00:53:16,720 --> 00:53:19,760
the cookie tray.
So I don't understand that

1011
00:53:19,760 --> 00:53:23,600
completely, but apparently they
called it that maybe because

1012
00:53:23,600 --> 00:53:25,120
they could pull him out on the
mattress.

1013
00:53:25,120 --> 00:53:28,000
I don't understand.
But that made me wonder, if he

1014
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:30,520
had a movable mattress, what the
heck did other people have?

1015
00:53:32,560 --> 00:53:35,080
I texted it to you.
Oh, a list of what?

1016
00:53:35,280 --> 00:53:38,840
OK, hold on.
Things of the creative, creative

1017
00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:40,880
ways they got around things like
AD LS.

1018
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:45,320
Oh, wow.
OK, so there's there.

1019
00:53:45,360 --> 00:53:46,720
Do you want to read a few of
those things?

1020
00:53:46,720 --> 00:53:50,320
Crystal found something online
that is interesting.

1021
00:53:50,400 --> 00:53:53,240
Yeah, sorry, I can't help but
research while we're talking.

1022
00:53:53,240 --> 00:53:55,480
Unless I'm.
If I'm talking, then I won't be

1023
00:53:55,480 --> 00:53:56,760
researching because I've already
done it.

1024
00:53:56,760 --> 00:53:59,440
But it's your turn.
I just, you know, I just can't.

1025
00:53:59,440 --> 00:54:02,520
But I can't myself.
It's like it's in my blood.

1026
00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:05,480
I do the same thing.
So some of the things they would

1027
00:54:05,480 --> 00:54:10,160
do is they would have a like a
trap door where there would be a

1028
00:54:10,200 --> 00:54:14,480
bedpan and they would, they were
able to take the bedpan out from

1029
00:54:14,480 --> 00:54:17,680
the bottom of the iron lung,
they replace it with a new one

1030
00:54:17,680 --> 00:54:20,960
and quickly close the trap door.
Some of the other things they

1031
00:54:20,960 --> 00:54:25,120
had tilt tables or rotating
frames so that you can, this is

1032
00:54:25,120 --> 00:54:28,800
probably the same as the cookie
tray so that you wouldn't, you

1033
00:54:28,800 --> 00:54:31,640
would get repositioned without
having to come out of the iron

1034
00:54:31,640 --> 00:54:33,200
lungs.
You know, the table itself would

1035
00:54:33,200 --> 00:54:35,720
reposition you a little bit.
So you might be a little lean to

1036
00:54:35,720 --> 00:54:38,160
the left or a little lean to the
back or a little whatever,

1037
00:54:38,160 --> 00:54:41,280
right.
Another thing they would do is

1038
00:54:41,440 --> 00:54:45,280
that sometimes they would feed
them really long utensils that

1039
00:54:45,280 --> 00:54:48,760
would go down into the tank to
get to wherever their mouth was

1040
00:54:48,760 --> 00:54:52,720
in comparison to their, you
know, to their seal, I guess.

1041
00:54:53,240 --> 00:54:56,320
Yeah, because it was very close
to the edge of the the tank,

1042
00:54:56,320 --> 00:54:59,240
because it was part of it.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

1043
00:54:59,240 --> 00:55:03,280
They would a lot of times it's,
it's a very normal thing.

1044
00:55:03,360 --> 00:55:07,440
All of all of us nurses and Cnas
are taught how to change a a bed

1045
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:10,200
when a person is in it, right.
So they would do that same sort

1046
00:55:10,200 --> 00:55:13,320
of change where you take off
half of the half of the linens,

1047
00:55:13,560 --> 00:55:17,760
put on the clean linens, half of
and then roll the person over

1048
00:55:17,760 --> 00:55:20,160
onto the clean side, pull off
the very side, but and you know,

1049
00:55:20,160 --> 00:55:21,840
pull on the cleans on the other
side.

1050
00:55:22,280 --> 00:55:26,400
And they would just do that
through the parts of the iron

1051
00:55:26,400 --> 00:55:31,080
lung that couldn't be unsealed.
Like like consider, OK, I'm

1052
00:55:31,240 --> 00:55:34,120
probably what I'm envisioning.
I, what I'm envisioning from the

1053
00:55:34,120 --> 00:55:37,360
description is like if you were
in scuba gear, and that's not a

1054
00:55:37,360 --> 00:55:40,720
scuba gear, but a wet suit, and
that wet suit is the pressure

1055
00:55:40,720 --> 00:55:43,320
part of the eye and lung, then
you'd be then on linens.

1056
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:47,400
And so they would just kind of
do it around, Sorry, I'm saying

1057
00:55:47,400 --> 00:55:51,200
it backwards.
It would be like if you were

1058
00:55:51,200 --> 00:55:54,600
wrapped in linens and then had a
wet suit over it, and then you'd

1059
00:55:54,600 --> 00:55:56,880
have to manipulate it using the
wet suit, but you were actually

1060
00:55:56,880 --> 00:55:59,400
manipulating the linens.
Yeah.

1061
00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:04,200
And, and I just, that had to
have taken a lot of time and

1062
00:56:04,200 --> 00:56:06,800
coordination.
And also I can't imagine it was

1063
00:56:06,800 --> 00:56:11,400
done all that often because it
was such such a big deal.

1064
00:56:11,720 --> 00:56:13,800
And I think.
About most specifically what

1065
00:56:13,800 --> 00:56:16,240
they said is it took a lot of
creativity and it took a lot of

1066
00:56:16,240 --> 00:56:18,960
people.
So this wasn't a one nurse job

1067
00:56:18,960 --> 00:56:21,360
1, you know, CNA or whatever
they were called back in the day

1068
00:56:21,360 --> 00:56:23,800
job.
This was like you have to you

1069
00:56:23,800 --> 00:56:26,240
had to recruit family members
and friends to help with these

1070
00:56:26,240 --> 00:56:27,200
sorts of things.
So.

1071
00:56:27,280 --> 00:56:29,640
Well, I'm also remembering the
fact that many of these people

1072
00:56:29,640 --> 00:56:32,520
could not breathe at all while
their machine was off Exactly,

1073
00:56:32,520 --> 00:56:36,400
so it had to be fast too.
And then I think about the.

1074
00:56:37,400 --> 00:56:39,920
It's scary, right?
Oh man, The idea, it's

1075
00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:43,320
unpleasant, just being at the
mercy of everybody around you as

1076
00:56:43,320 --> 00:56:46,280
they, you know, remake your bed
or whatever, and you do not get

1077
00:56:46,280 --> 00:56:48,040
to have your next breath until
they're done.

1078
00:56:48,480 --> 00:56:51,120
Right.
And the Paula Alexander will be

1079
00:56:51,120 --> 00:56:53,800
talking about in a minute some
of the things that happened

1080
00:56:53,800 --> 00:56:56,560
through his life.
But I'm back to the bedpan.

1081
00:56:57,160 --> 00:57:00,360
I think about the times that
I've removed bedpans and they've

1082
00:57:00,360 --> 00:57:05,040
tipped a little.
I don't, I mean it's difficult

1083
00:57:05,520 --> 00:57:09,360
under the best of circumstances
to remove a full bedpan and to

1084
00:57:09,360 --> 00:57:13,320
try and do it in an iron lung
and trying even, I mean, I

1085
00:57:13,320 --> 00:57:15,960
always tried very hard not to
spill anything, but if I did, I

1086
00:57:15,960 --> 00:57:18,360
could clean it up right quick
and change things or whatever.

1087
00:57:18,360 --> 00:57:21,920
Pretty easy.
Independent person, it was still

1088
00:57:21,960 --> 00:57:23,800
fairly easy, but they were open
air.

1089
00:57:23,800 --> 00:57:27,480
I could just move around and
think to try and do that with an

1090
00:57:27,480 --> 00:57:29,840
iron lung all around.
And also again, the person not

1091
00:57:29,840 --> 00:57:31,320
breathing.
I just can't even imagine the

1092
00:57:31,320 --> 00:57:34,360
pressure that would be for the
15 bottle too.

1093
00:57:35,160 --> 00:57:36,480
Yeah.
No kidding.

1094
00:57:36,880 --> 00:57:38,840
Yeah.
And so thanks for that.

1095
00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:43,680
But back to our Mike Mark
O'Brien and.

1096
00:57:44,360 --> 00:57:47,480
I say sorry so much.
Please don't send us messages

1097
00:57:47,480 --> 00:57:49,120
that tell me to stop saying
sorry.

1098
00:57:51,240 --> 00:57:53,600
That's OK.
It's just who we are, right?

1099
00:57:54,160 --> 00:57:57,760
Like I said, Mark was diagnosed
when he was six with polio and

1100
00:57:58,040 --> 00:58:02,440
he always had to have that
assistive device and he was

1101
00:58:02,440 --> 00:58:05,280
using his cookie tray, which got
us off the track that we were

1102
00:58:05,280 --> 00:58:06,960
talking about.
But I wanted to revisit it so

1103
00:58:06,960 --> 00:58:08,680
everyone remembered what we were
talking about.

1104
00:58:09,200 --> 00:58:12,600
Just note to listeners that only
reason I remember is because I

1105
00:58:12,600 --> 00:58:17,440
have notes in front of me.
But when he he went to the

1106
00:58:17,440 --> 00:58:22,920
University of California, he
went to college and he had to

1107
00:58:22,920 --> 00:58:26,600
use a motorized Gurney to get
through the campus and then he'd

1108
00:58:26,600 --> 00:58:29,320
go home to use the iron lung.
So this is when we were talking

1109
00:58:29,320 --> 00:58:33,400
about he would be off for a
period of time, but he couldn't

1110
00:58:33,400 --> 00:58:37,360
walk and he didn't motorized
Gurney and then use the iron

1111
00:58:37,360 --> 00:58:40,720
lung.
And so I'm not sure exactly how

1112
00:58:41,280 --> 00:58:44,800
how he could get by.
Maybe he'd go for an hour or

1113
00:58:44,800 --> 00:58:47,680
two, I'm not really sure.
It didn't go into details in

1114
00:58:47,680 --> 00:58:50,800
this article about how he
actually got through at the

1115
00:58:50,800 --> 00:58:54,800
moment, but he's considered his
iron lung kind of his his second

1116
00:58:54,800 --> 00:58:59,280
home because he had to live into
it for four decades.

1117
00:58:59,320 --> 00:59:02,680
Oh, my gosh, yeah.
As he grew up, though, he

1118
00:59:02,680 --> 00:59:05,080
noticed that polio survivors,
including himself, were

1119
00:59:05,080 --> 00:59:07,320
extremely excluded from the
world around them.

1120
00:59:07,360 --> 00:59:10,040
You know, the iron lung added to
this feeling of seclusion

1121
00:59:10,040 --> 00:59:14,000
because even when he was out, he
still knew he had to go back to

1122
00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:16,920
it.
And he looked for ways to bring

1123
00:59:17,040 --> 00:59:20,600
this second home of his iron
lung to just stop having to need

1124
00:59:20,600 --> 00:59:23,160
it.
And also if he didn't, he

1125
00:59:23,160 --> 00:59:26,360
couldn't stop that, at least to
start feeling less secluded.

1126
00:59:26,840 --> 00:59:32,200
And so he started to really work
on ending discrimination against

1127
00:59:32,480 --> 00:59:36,160
disabled people.
And it also inspired him to

1128
00:59:36,400 --> 00:59:40,440
compound the lemonade factory.
And I hadn't heard anything

1129
00:59:40,440 --> 00:59:44,120
about this before, but it was a
small press that like a printing

1130
00:59:44,120 --> 00:59:46,680
press where they published
various things.

1131
00:59:47,040 --> 00:59:50,560
And they published, It was in
Berkeley, and they published

1132
00:59:50,560 --> 00:59:52,840
poetry by people with
disabilities.

1133
00:59:53,320 --> 00:59:54,840
So it gave.
Yeah.

1134
00:59:54,840 --> 00:59:57,440
And it gave the people with
disabilities a voice to the

1135
00:59:57,440 --> 00:59:58,800
public.
It was the first time that it

1136
00:59:58,800 --> 00:59:59,480
ever happened.
Wow.

1137
01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:03,200
Yeah.
And so that was good.

1138
01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:05,840
And if anywhere in the world
would or the United States would

1139
01:00:05,840 --> 01:00:07,800
do it, Berkeley is definitely
one of those.

1140
01:00:07,800 --> 01:00:09,680
Places.
Was it clear at Berkeley?

1141
01:00:10,280 --> 01:00:14,280
It was in Berkeley, the town.
Like I said, it gave them a

1142
01:00:14,280 --> 01:00:16,720
voice and.
I love that.

1143
01:00:17,120 --> 01:00:19,240
I do too.
And there was a film directed by

1144
01:00:19,480 --> 01:00:22,720
a woman named Jessica Yu and it
was called Breathing Lessons,

1145
01:00:22,720 --> 01:00:24,840
The Life and Work of Mark
O'Brien.

1146
01:00:24,840 --> 01:00:28,640
So it talked about his life and
how he and how he did things and

1147
01:00:28,640 --> 01:00:31,240
it connects the audience to his
struggle to live his life

1148
01:00:31,240 --> 01:00:33,760
independently.
And then it talks a lot.

1149
01:00:33,760 --> 01:00:36,560
So if you want to learn more
about Mark O'Brien, if you watch

1150
01:00:36,560 --> 01:00:41,200
that The Life and Work of Mark
O'Brien, it talks about his life

1151
01:00:41,200 --> 01:00:45,120
from his perspective.
And the quote about it is it's

1152
01:00:45,120 --> 01:00:47,760
an intimate window into the
reality of the life of severe

1153
01:00:47,760 --> 01:00:50,240
disability, as well as an
illuminating portrait of a

1154
01:00:50,240 --> 01:00:53,760
remarkable artist.
And I really liked that.

1155
01:00:54,040 --> 01:00:57,720
And, you know, noted here as we
talked briefly, this didn't stop

1156
01:00:57,720 --> 01:01:01,040
discrimination of people with
disease because there's still

1157
01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:05,560
issues now, even accessibility
issues, which are shocking

1158
01:01:05,560 --> 01:01:07,440
because it shouldn't be that
way.

1159
01:01:07,960 --> 01:01:11,280
But there were some steps that
were taken for the first time

1160
01:01:11,360 --> 01:01:16,760
that anyone's really recorded.
This one is a woman named in in

1161
01:01:16,760 --> 01:01:19,600
board.
Cully was 35 and she was a

1162
01:01:19,880 --> 01:01:23,400
mother of three children, but
she passed passed away in 1961.

1163
01:01:23,520 --> 01:01:26,800
It was described that she took
air quotes, a sudden turn for

1164
01:01:26,800 --> 01:01:29,680
the worse, and her battle
against polio.

1165
01:01:29,720 --> 01:01:34,760
A few years prior to that, 1956,
just after having contracted

1166
01:01:34,760 --> 01:01:38,240
polio, she had a normal
childbirth with her second

1167
01:01:38,240 --> 01:01:41,320
child.
So she was paralyzed, but she

1168
01:01:41,320 --> 01:01:45,760
was able to birth this child.
And this is interesting.

1169
01:01:45,920 --> 01:01:48,880
It says that for this
magnificent feat, she was

1170
01:01:48,880 --> 01:01:52,240
awarded the Queen's Polio Mother
of the Year Award 1958.

1171
01:01:52,280 --> 01:01:54,520
Didn't know that.
I know.

1172
01:01:54,520 --> 01:01:56,120
I didn't even know it was the
thing.

1173
01:01:56,480 --> 01:01:59,880
But she did become paralyzed
from the waist up.

1174
01:02:00,160 --> 01:02:04,040
So I imagine that's how she was
able to have the baby.

1175
01:02:04,040 --> 01:02:06,840
And then remarkably, she got
pregnant again.

1176
01:02:07,240 --> 01:02:11,360
And it was said to be more
difficult than the the last

1177
01:02:11,360 --> 01:02:15,880
birth, which is interesting to
me because she was just first

1178
01:02:15,880 --> 01:02:19,440
paralyzed in the beginning at
the 1st, at the the childbirth

1179
01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:23,800
she had with her second child.
And then the third she had more

1180
01:02:23,800 --> 01:02:28,520
difficulty and she was in the
iron lung.

1181
01:02:28,840 --> 01:02:32,520
So I don't know how pregnancy
occurred, but I don't either.

1182
01:02:33,080 --> 01:02:37,120
But she came out of the iron
lung for 90 minutes during the

1183
01:02:37,120 --> 01:02:41,680
complicated and difficult birth,
and she had to have air pumped

1184
01:02:41,680 --> 01:02:43,360
into her lungs through a tube in
her throat.

1185
01:02:43,360 --> 01:02:46,080
Tracheotomy and the delivery was
successful.

1186
01:02:46,400 --> 01:02:48,440
But she passed away within the
year.

1187
01:02:48,520 --> 01:02:52,440
So there may be some argument
about why did she get pregnant.

1188
01:02:52,440 --> 01:02:54,360
I don't really know how that all
worked.

1189
01:02:54,680 --> 01:02:57,200
I'm sure there's more detail,
but again, another rabbit hole

1190
01:02:57,200 --> 01:03:02,600
that I did not go down.
So one of the things that they

1191
01:03:02,600 --> 01:03:06,160
talked about as with this Mark
O'Brien person, a few people

1192
01:03:06,160 --> 01:03:11,480
that were in the iron lungs did
make educational advances and

1193
01:03:11,480 --> 01:03:14,960
getting higher higher education.
And Paula Alexander is someone

1194
01:03:14,960 --> 01:03:19,040
we'll talk about.
But he, he was as far as I read

1195
01:03:19,040 --> 01:03:21,760
anywhere, he was the person who
was in an iron lung for the

1196
01:03:21,760 --> 01:03:24,920
longest period of time, which
was 70 years, I believe.

1197
01:03:25,440 --> 01:03:30,520
And he was confined to his iron
lung.

1198
01:03:30,520 --> 01:03:33,680
He contracted the disease in
1952 at six.

1199
01:03:33,760 --> 01:03:39,640
He was very amazing, for sure.
We'll talk at length about his

1200
01:03:39,640 --> 01:03:42,680
story in a minute, but he's one
that is referred to in almost

1201
01:03:42,720 --> 01:03:47,440
every every documentation of
people being in iron lungs and

1202
01:03:47,440 --> 01:03:49,240
being there for any period of
time.

1203
01:03:49,440 --> 01:03:53,240
Also, there were people called
Mona Randolph and Jim Costello,

1204
01:03:53,680 --> 01:03:57,960
and they became prominent
figures for the disabled with

1205
01:03:57,960 --> 01:04:00,120
their organizations for
disability awareness.

1206
01:04:00,480 --> 01:04:03,640
And Mona spent the majority of
her life in iron lung.

1207
01:04:03,760 --> 01:04:05,680
She performed what was called
the Whole Person.

1208
01:04:06,200 --> 01:04:10,840
It was an organization that
still exists as an advocate for

1209
01:04:10,840 --> 01:04:13,520
individuals with disabilities in
Kansas, Kansas City.

1210
01:04:13,600 --> 01:04:18,680
It's just to me, the fact that
they kept doing anything is

1211
01:04:18,680 --> 01:04:22,400
shocking because they had, if
anybody has a reason to say

1212
01:04:22,400 --> 01:04:24,040
Nope, I'm just going.
To thank you.

1213
01:04:24,360 --> 01:04:26,760
Yeah, then these people are the
ones.

1214
01:04:27,040 --> 01:04:34,800
And Mona passed away in 2019.
And Jim Costello was previously

1215
01:04:34,800 --> 01:04:37,640
an iron lung patient, so she had
been in an iron lung.

1216
01:04:37,640 --> 01:04:40,840
And he was from Ireland.
He contracted polio when he was

1217
01:04:40,840 --> 01:04:43,600
15.
He was heavily paralyzed.

1218
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:48,200
And he went with six others and
set up a charity called Post

1219
01:04:48,200 --> 01:04:51,800
Polio Syndrome.
And he was awarded the Louis

1220
01:04:51,800 --> 01:04:54,760
Pasteur Polio Hero Medal in
Paris in 2016.

1221
01:04:54,880 --> 01:05:00,840
They were people who were able
to escape the adversity of the

1222
01:05:00,840 --> 01:05:05,480
iron lung and the psychological
issues that come with it by

1223
01:05:05,480 --> 01:05:09,160
looking outside themselves in a
way that I can't see that most

1224
01:05:09,160 --> 01:05:11,360
people would have done.
Some people are just built a

1225
01:05:11,400 --> 01:05:13,800
certain way, you know.
It's.

1226
01:05:13,880 --> 01:05:16,680
Crazy.
It's it's impressive.

1227
01:05:17,400 --> 01:05:20,000
Yeah, it it really is.
And there's story as several

1228
01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:22,440
stories about people who have
done things like that.

1229
01:05:22,720 --> 01:05:25,560
The one I want to go into
further, as I've talked about a

1230
01:05:25,560 --> 01:05:29,080
few times, is Paula Alexander.
The way it was reported, this

1231
01:05:29,080 --> 01:05:34,120
was a description that he later
gave, is that he was six years

1232
01:05:34,120 --> 01:05:37,080
old.
And he woke terrified to find

1233
01:05:37,080 --> 01:05:40,560
himself inside a large metal
tube with only his head sticking

1234
01:05:40,560 --> 01:05:45,520
out and he couldn't move and he
couldn't feel what was trapping

1235
01:05:45,520 --> 01:05:47,480
him.
And he tried to call for help.

1236
01:05:47,480 --> 01:05:49,360
He discovered he couldn't make a
sound.

1237
01:05:49,920 --> 01:05:52,360
That's how it was described.
Can you imagine?

1238
01:05:52,920 --> 01:05:58,480
No, me either.
Paul had survived this bout of

1239
01:05:58,480 --> 01:06:04,440
polio, but he had been left a
quadriplegic at six years old,

1240
01:06:05,600 --> 01:06:09,720
and he had an emergency
tracheostomy, and he was unable

1241
01:06:09,720 --> 01:06:14,160
to breathe without the iron lung
that was encasing his entire

1242
01:06:14,160 --> 01:06:16,160
body.
We'll talk a little bit more

1243
01:06:16,160 --> 01:06:22,600
here about how he did.
And he was in Texas in 1952.

1244
01:06:22,600 --> 01:06:25,040
There were a lot of other
children in the same situation.

1245
01:06:25,400 --> 01:06:28,280
And according to the World
Health Organization, one in 200

1246
01:06:28,280 --> 01:06:31,920
polio infections leads to
irreversible, irreversible

1247
01:06:31,920 --> 01:06:37,920
paralysis.
One in 200 that's huge to

1248
01:06:37,920 --> 01:06:43,320
irreversible paralysis and along
those that are paralyzed, 5 to

1249
01:06:43,320 --> 01:06:46,280
10% die with their breathing
when their breathing muscles

1250
01:06:46,280 --> 01:06:50,160
become immobilized.
So many, many, many the five to

1251
01:06:50,160 --> 01:06:54,160
10% will die before they even
get assistance is the way I read

1252
01:06:54,160 --> 01:06:56,600
that.
And they just because as we

1253
01:06:56,600 --> 01:07:01,640
said, polio has these precursor,
what I mean, polio itself has

1254
01:07:01,640 --> 01:07:05,800
those kind of random almost
every kind of illness sort of

1255
01:07:05,800 --> 01:07:07,840
symptoms.
But it's when it goes past that

1256
01:07:07,840 --> 01:07:10,720
10 day mark and it starts
becoming more significant.

1257
01:07:11,200 --> 01:07:14,480
But I can imagine being a parent
of a child with polio,

1258
01:07:14,480 --> 01:07:18,920
especially like now when it's
coming back and people are less

1259
01:07:18,920 --> 01:07:23,160
aware of it than they were in
the whole epidemic, big epidemic

1260
01:07:23,160 --> 01:07:25,440
years.
They wouldn't necessarily think

1261
01:07:25,440 --> 01:07:27,000
of polio.
I wouldn't.

1262
01:07:27,480 --> 01:07:30,520
I mean, if my kids when they
were little had gotten polio

1263
01:07:30,520 --> 01:07:32,920
symptoms, I would have thought,
oh, they're just sick.

1264
01:07:32,920 --> 01:07:35,000
They have a flu.
And if they didn't get

1265
01:07:35,000 --> 01:07:39,200
particularly I'll, I probably
would have gone to work and

1266
01:07:39,200 --> 01:07:42,720
talked to my doctor, hospital
friends about it and that maybe,

1267
01:07:42,760 --> 01:07:45,360
maybe not.
Maybe it wouldn't be notified or

1268
01:07:45,360 --> 01:07:47,960
identified.
And then they could just stop

1269
01:07:47,960 --> 01:07:50,760
breathing, which, yeah.
It's horrifying.

1270
01:07:51,520 --> 01:07:53,320
Yeah, it is.
It is.

1271
01:07:53,320 --> 01:07:58,680
So Paul was in the hospital for
two years in this iron lung, and

1272
01:07:58,960 --> 01:08:03,000
the doctors kept saying, you
know, he has a future that is

1273
01:08:03,000 --> 01:08:06,640
looking pretty sketchy.
So they just didn't really worry

1274
01:08:06,640 --> 01:08:08,440
about him.
They didn't want to deal with

1275
01:08:08,440 --> 01:08:10,600
it.
Basically, it sounds like and.

1276
01:08:11,240 --> 01:08:13,560
So sad.
I know it's just like, well he's

1277
01:08:13,560 --> 01:08:16,399
useless, whatever.
And so he would have been 8 by

1278
01:08:16,399 --> 01:08:21,880
then, and his parents decided to
take him home in his iron lung.

1279
01:08:23,680 --> 01:08:26,560
And I can't even imagine how
scary that thought was.

1280
01:08:27,640 --> 01:08:30,240
They weren't medically trained.
I mean, they may have learned

1281
01:08:30,359 --> 01:08:32,160
over the two years he was in the
hospital.

1282
01:08:32,160 --> 01:08:34,680
I'm sure they learned stuff.
But for heaven's sakes, I don't

1283
01:08:34,680 --> 01:08:36,800
know if I want to bring someone
home in an iron lung.

1284
01:08:37,399 --> 01:08:41,640
And but they decided to do it
because they just wanted him to

1285
01:08:41,640 --> 01:08:45,160
live out his days in peace.
So it sounds like with that idea

1286
01:08:45,160 --> 01:08:47,960
that they probably thought it
was kind of over for him too.

1287
01:08:48,560 --> 01:08:52,040
And they were they were in the
home.

1288
01:08:52,040 --> 01:08:56,080
And he said instead of dying, he
went from strength to strength

1289
01:08:56,399 --> 01:08:58,160
once he was home in his parents
care.

1290
01:08:58,680 --> 01:09:01,279
So I guess the care that they
were able to provide him

1291
01:09:01,479 --> 01:09:05,359
assisted him to develop more
than he ever would have been in

1292
01:09:05,800 --> 01:09:08,240
the hospital.
Crazy.

1293
01:09:08,279 --> 01:09:15,040
OK, so here he is in his home
and as we know in home sometimes

1294
01:09:15,040 --> 01:09:18,000
power goes out.
Bummer dude, that's bad.

1295
01:09:18,479 --> 01:09:24,040
And these bellows that made this
iron lung do its negative

1296
01:09:24,160 --> 01:09:28,760
pressure and in and out and in
and out had to be pumped by

1297
01:09:28,760 --> 01:09:31,040
hand.
And it says that when that

1298
01:09:31,040 --> 01:09:35,080
happened, the neighbors would
come to help and his father.

1299
01:09:35,319 --> 01:09:38,640
So they would do the pumping of
these bellows for as long as it

1300
01:09:38,640 --> 01:09:40,640
took for the power to come back
on.

1301
01:09:40,640 --> 01:09:45,520
And in the 50s, I don't know
what ratio of time that would

1302
01:09:45,520 --> 01:09:49,200
be, but it any amount of time
would be bad.

1303
01:09:49,600 --> 01:09:53,080
And to be standing there being
responsible for someone's

1304
01:09:53,080 --> 01:09:55,920
breathing.
We've got all of the Ambu bags

1305
01:09:55,920 --> 01:09:58,920
and things like that now, but
this was a bigger system there

1306
01:09:58,920 --> 01:10:01,680
where they had to probably put a
fair amount of energy into it.

1307
01:10:02,240 --> 01:10:05,040
And Paul's father designed an
alarm bell that Paul could ring

1308
01:10:05,040 --> 01:10:07,440
using his mouth if he needed
urgent attention.

1309
01:10:07,520 --> 01:10:10,240
He because remember, he still
couldn't really speak yet.

1310
01:10:10,400 --> 01:10:12,520
If he needed something, he had
no way of getting you an

1311
01:10:12,520 --> 01:10:14,600
attention.
He couldn't lift his arms to

1312
01:10:14,600 --> 01:10:17,160
bang on the iron lung.
He couldn't do anything.

1313
01:10:17,720 --> 01:10:21,040
And I just think of how scary
and especially he's still a

1314
01:10:21,040 --> 01:10:26,720
young child to be relate to that
is wow.

1315
01:10:26,720 --> 01:10:30,360
I just over time, Paul learned
to consciously breathe by

1316
01:10:30,360 --> 01:10:33,560
gulping down air.
He was able to use his throat

1317
01:10:33,560 --> 01:10:36,960
muscles and somehow he figured
out that if he gulped, he could

1318
01:10:36,960 --> 01:10:40,120
breathe.
And he called it frog breathing.

1319
01:10:41,600 --> 01:10:43,880
I don't know why frogs do that.
I don't know.

1320
01:10:44,280 --> 01:10:46,600
But his younger brother,
Phillip.

1321
01:10:47,240 --> 01:10:53,480
This was this this topic of of
Paul was in the BBC article I

1322
01:10:53,480 --> 01:10:56,680
talked about before.
And so he Phillip explained to

1323
01:10:56,680 --> 01:11:00,440
the BBC that the promise of a
puppy gave Paul the incentive to

1324
01:11:00,440 --> 01:11:04,160
be brave and attempt to spend
time out of his iron lung to

1325
01:11:04,160 --> 01:11:08,840
learn the complicated breathing
technique that was of the day.

1326
01:11:09,200 --> 01:11:12,960
And that was the medical term
for frog breathing was what Paul

1327
01:11:12,960 --> 01:11:16,440
called because it was difficult
to say glossopharyngeal

1328
01:11:16,440 --> 01:11:19,120
breathing is what it's called.
So frog breathing is better.

1329
01:11:19,320 --> 01:11:23,160
So Phillips says that Paul would
was afraid of choking to death

1330
01:11:24,080 --> 01:11:28,520
and which I can understand
because if no, you can't breathe

1331
01:11:28,520 --> 01:11:30,720
outside this machine, what the
heck do you want to go outside

1332
01:11:30,720 --> 01:11:34,240
this machine for?
They told him if you last three

1333
01:11:34,240 --> 01:11:36,080
minutes, you'll get the dog that
you want.

1334
01:11:36,280 --> 01:11:39,800
So he did.
And I mean a boy and his dog,

1335
01:11:39,800 --> 01:11:43,960
right?
But Paul, Paul realized that he

1336
01:11:43,960 --> 01:11:47,160
could get out and his strength
and confidence grew for

1337
01:11:47,160 --> 01:11:50,440
breathing and he was able to
spend increasingly longer period

1338
01:11:50,440 --> 01:11:53,120
that of the iron lung.
And as I said, the people who

1339
01:11:53,120 --> 01:11:55,800
were able to get out of it were
in situations like that were

1340
01:11:55,800 --> 01:11:58,520
either their their paralysis
receded.

1341
01:11:58,560 --> 01:12:01,320
And so they weren't either as
paralyzed or not paralyzed at

1342
01:12:01,320 --> 01:12:04,840
all, or they developed ways to
breathe outside the iron lung

1343
01:12:04,840 --> 01:12:07,520
for a period of time.
And so Paul was able to

1344
01:12:07,520 --> 01:12:09,120
experience a little bit more of
life.

1345
01:12:09,240 --> 01:12:11,840
He was able to go out into the
neighborhood with his wheelchair

1346
01:12:11,840 --> 01:12:14,280
with his friends.
And yeah.

1347
01:12:14,280 --> 01:12:16,800
And then when he was tired, as I
mentioned before, that was the

1348
01:12:16,800 --> 01:12:19,280
problem as they get so tired
because it's such a big effort.

1349
01:12:19,560 --> 01:12:21,920
I mean, think about it, if you
had to actually consciously be

1350
01:12:21,920 --> 01:12:24,880
breathing, I guess the person
would know when to do it by

1351
01:12:24,880 --> 01:12:26,600
whether they feel like they have
to or not.

1352
01:12:27,000 --> 01:12:30,040
Anyway, he said they'd return
him to the Iron Man when he was

1353
01:12:30,040 --> 01:12:33,720
tired so it could take over for
him, Phillip said.

1354
01:12:34,040 --> 01:12:35,840
This is a quote from Phillip.
I thought it was cute.

1355
01:12:36,040 --> 01:12:38,000
He said he was just a normal
brother to me.

1356
01:12:38,000 --> 01:12:41,200
We fought, we played, we loved,
we partied, we went to concerts

1357
01:12:41,200 --> 01:12:42,840
together.
He was just a normal brother.

1358
01:12:43,160 --> 01:12:46,080
And that's awesome because
Phillip, I mean, I don't know

1359
01:12:46,440 --> 01:12:48,200
you.
You fought with a kid in an iron

1360
01:12:48,200 --> 01:12:50,160
lung.
What are you finding?

1361
01:12:51,200 --> 01:12:53,640
But so Paul finished the school
at home.

1362
01:12:53,640 --> 01:12:57,960
So he did homeschooling up until
high school, and then he went on

1363
01:12:58,040 --> 01:13:02,840
to earn a college degree from
home, which was new for that

1364
01:13:02,840 --> 01:13:04,600
time.
Because remember, that would

1365
01:13:04,600 --> 01:13:09,160
have been, let's see, 12 June, I
guess the mid 70s probably.

1366
01:13:09,520 --> 01:13:12,120
And then Paul decided to set his
sights on law school.

1367
01:13:13,120 --> 01:13:18,320
And I mean, this spirit of this
can't, can't put you down.

1368
01:13:18,880 --> 01:13:23,400
And Phillip in this interview
continued to say that Paul's

1369
01:13:23,400 --> 01:13:26,800
time at the University of Texas
in Austin was incredible.

1370
01:13:27,200 --> 01:13:31,680
And his Paul's parents helped
him move in with his iron lung.

1371
01:13:31,760 --> 01:13:34,360
Then he was on his own at
college.

1372
01:13:34,560 --> 01:13:35,520
Just bye.
Good luck.

1373
01:13:35,520 --> 01:13:39,240
Now, I don't know.
And he did have limited help at

1374
01:13:39,240 --> 01:13:43,200
first.
Then the carer they had hired

1375
01:13:43,200 --> 01:13:46,920
didn't show up and so he didn't
really have any caregivers.

1376
01:13:46,920 --> 01:13:49,120
He was in the dorm and different
people just take care of him

1377
01:13:49,120 --> 01:13:52,360
accidentally.
That's like some nice people.

1378
01:13:52,520 --> 01:13:56,240
I know they they pushed him
around the campus in his

1379
01:13:56,240 --> 01:13:58,520
wheelchair because again, he had
built up some time that he could

1380
01:13:58,520 --> 01:14:01,440
be out.
But I imagine, I mean, he was

1381
01:14:01,440 --> 01:14:04,280
still paralyzed.
It's not like that stopped, but

1382
01:14:04,280 --> 01:14:05,840
he could breathe.
So that was something.

1383
01:14:05,960 --> 01:14:08,760
Then he just went on to practice
law in downtown Dallas.

1384
01:14:08,920 --> 01:14:12,840
He he had it says here that he
had to deal with the surprise of

1385
01:14:12,840 --> 01:14:15,920
clients on entering his office
and seeing him in his iron lung.

1386
01:14:16,520 --> 01:14:18,080
Can you imagine walking into
your attorney?

1387
01:14:18,080 --> 01:14:20,520
I'm like, hey, what, what what
are you doing in there?

1388
01:14:20,840 --> 01:14:25,880
When I guess it wasn't the first
topic, but he said his brother

1389
01:14:25,880 --> 01:14:28,840
said it wasn't an easy thing to
see just a head sticking out.

1390
01:14:29,200 --> 01:14:32,520
And they, the people kind of
went into shock and then they

1391
01:14:32,520 --> 01:14:35,840
were OK, you know, well,
obviously they, his brain worked

1392
01:14:35,840 --> 01:14:37,440
just fine.
Just the rest of them didn't.

1393
01:14:37,440 --> 01:14:40,800
Which to bring up is a good
point because many people who

1394
01:14:40,800 --> 01:14:43,920
are in wheelchairs, their brains
are perfectly fine.

1395
01:14:44,200 --> 01:14:46,200
It's their bodies that aren't
working.

1396
01:14:46,200 --> 01:14:49,360
And that's that's something that
I think a lot of people forget

1397
01:14:49,360 --> 01:14:52,920
is that if someone's has any
form of disability that their

1398
01:14:52,920 --> 01:14:56,120
brain isn't working and there
are disabilities that do have

1399
01:14:56,200 --> 01:15:00,400
different cognitive levels.
But to automatically assume that

1400
01:15:00,400 --> 01:15:03,800
people, to me, it's important
that we give everyone that we're

1401
01:15:03,800 --> 01:15:06,240
around the benefit of the doubt,
if you will.

1402
01:15:06,560 --> 01:15:10,360
And don't assume that there's a
problem, but find out what their

1403
01:15:10,360 --> 01:15:13,600
capacities are.
But Paul lived, Paul lived alone

1404
01:15:13,600 --> 01:15:17,440
for much of his adult life,
which I can't even again, he

1405
01:15:17,440 --> 01:15:24,080
lived alone and he had minimal
caretakers and he really

1406
01:15:24,080 --> 01:15:26,680
couldn't take care of his basic
human needs like using the

1407
01:15:26,680 --> 01:15:29,200
toilet or getting a drink.
So people did have to help him

1408
01:15:29,200 --> 01:15:32,360
with that.
He was able to express what he

1409
01:15:32,360 --> 01:15:36,720
needed to people so that they
could help him and he could even

1410
01:15:36,720 --> 01:15:38,920
help them.
Phillip said that he needed a

1411
01:15:38,920 --> 01:15:43,000
unique type of care.
And because he was a

1412
01:15:43,000 --> 01:15:46,840
quadriplegic in an iron lung,
Phillip did a lot of the

1413
01:15:46,840 --> 01:15:50,360
assistance for his brother
because, you know, he was his

1414
01:15:50,360 --> 01:15:53,400
brother.
And, and Phillip said that most

1415
01:15:53,400 --> 01:15:55,640
care was basic shaving and
feeding, for example.

1416
01:15:55,640 --> 01:15:58,400
But to move him, you need to be
careful not to jam his finger

1417
01:15:58,400 --> 01:16:00,640
and so on.
So like he was saying that it

1418
01:16:00,640 --> 01:16:04,600
was difficult with the iron lung
to move him and not hurt him on

1419
01:16:04,600 --> 01:16:08,520
the iron lung.
And he said he said there was no

1420
01:16:08,520 --> 01:16:11,600
instruction manual for those who
answered Paul's advertisements

1421
01:16:11,600 --> 01:16:13,880
for caregivers.
There was just they just had to

1422
01:16:13,880 --> 01:16:16,880
learn as they went.
Phillip said many of them left

1423
01:16:16,880 --> 01:16:19,520
after a couple of days because
it was a lot.

1424
01:16:19,640 --> 01:16:22,880
And Phillip tried to to go to
care facilities and see if if

1425
01:16:22,880 --> 01:16:24,800
they would help Paul, they can
take him.

1426
01:16:24,800 --> 01:16:27,440
And they said no, they just,
they just couldn't.

1427
01:16:27,720 --> 01:16:31,840
He did have one, one person that
had cared for him for decades.

1428
01:16:32,080 --> 01:16:35,480
And her name was Kathy Gaines.
And she's to me surprisingly

1429
01:16:35,480 --> 01:16:39,360
died before Paul did.
And Paul was just devastated

1430
01:16:39,360 --> 01:16:42,760
that she had gone partially
because I imagine if he she

1431
01:16:42,760 --> 01:16:45,440
worked for him for decades, she
knew what he needed.

1432
01:16:45,440 --> 01:16:48,440
She knew how to do it.
And, And things must have gone

1433
01:16:48,440 --> 01:16:51,920
pretty, pretty well.
Philip said he always saw

1434
01:16:51,920 --> 01:16:54,160
himself as backup caregiver for
his brother.

1435
01:16:54,240 --> 01:16:56,840
He said, though, that his
brother developed his own

1436
01:16:56,840 --> 01:16:59,560
support system.
And he had a lot of wonderful

1437
01:16:59,560 --> 01:17:01,880
friends and some really
beautiful people in his life.

1438
01:17:01,880 --> 01:17:05,080
One of the people, yeah, one of
the people that came into his

1439
01:17:05,080 --> 01:17:09,640
life happened around in, well,
it was in 2015, and his iron

1440
01:17:09,640 --> 01:17:13,160
lung began to leak.
And the problem was these

1441
01:17:13,160 --> 01:17:16,760
machines were extremely rare
because people weren't using

1442
01:17:16,760 --> 01:17:20,360
them anymore.
And 2015 he was still in an iron

1443
01:17:20,360 --> 01:17:23,320
lung.
This is amazing.

1444
01:17:23,640 --> 01:17:26,600
And so they had to hurry and
find someone that could to could

1445
01:17:26,600 --> 01:17:28,920
fix it because it wasn't
airtight.

1446
01:17:28,920 --> 01:17:31,480
So it wasn't helping him breathe
the way it was supposed to.

1447
01:17:32,040 --> 01:17:35,240
And so apparently they posted a
plea on social media.

1448
01:17:35,240 --> 01:17:39,040
Responses came from all over the
world is it's so amazing to me.

1449
01:17:39,280 --> 01:17:44,080
Luckily, the solution that they
were able to use was someone who

1450
01:17:44,080 --> 01:17:48,000
was 10 miles down the road, this
company that was a mechanical

1451
01:17:48,000 --> 01:17:51,680
durability business and they did
environmental testing.

1452
01:17:51,720 --> 01:17:54,640
This lab was owned by this guy
named Brady.

1453
01:17:54,640 --> 01:17:57,960
He had come into possession of 2
iron lungs at a building

1454
01:17:57,960 --> 01:17:59,800
clearance sale.
What?

1455
01:18:00,560 --> 01:18:02,920
That's crazy.
You know, I'm like, Oh yeah,

1456
01:18:02,920 --> 01:18:04,360
sure, I'll take those iron
lungs.

1457
01:18:04,360 --> 01:18:07,920
Why not?
And he said he, he had a

1458
01:18:07,920 --> 01:18:10,480
paramedic walk in one day and
said, is this the place I can

1459
01:18:10,480 --> 01:18:15,720
find iron lungs?
I mean, the whole thing is well,

1460
01:18:15,920 --> 01:18:19,240
yes, actually.
And this this medic had been

1461
01:18:19,240 --> 01:18:21,200
transporting Paul to and from
hospital.

1462
01:18:21,280 --> 01:18:23,080
He.
Knew that he was Paul was in

1463
01:18:23,080 --> 01:18:26,880
this failing iron lung.
And as it became more desperate,

1464
01:18:27,040 --> 01:18:31,880
the situation got known and word
of mouth brought this paramedic

1465
01:18:31,880 --> 01:18:33,920
to Mr. Richards.
That was wild.

1466
01:18:33,920 --> 01:18:36,560
They they were able to take care
of it.

1467
01:18:36,560 --> 01:18:38,800
And it's just to me, it's so
funny.

1468
01:18:38,800 --> 01:18:40,600
Hey, is this where I can buy an
iron lung?

1469
01:18:40,800 --> 01:18:43,000
Well, yes, here's 2.
Which do you prefer?

1470
01:18:43,480 --> 01:18:48,120
And so it was, it was able to be
taken care of.

1471
01:18:48,440 --> 01:18:54,760
And, and this Mr. Richards had,
was kind of one of those

1472
01:18:54,760 --> 01:18:57,560
tinkerer kind of people.
And he had built parts from

1473
01:18:57,560 --> 01:19:00,400
scratch and salvage others and
scavenge things.

1474
01:19:00,800 --> 01:19:03,560
And he had learned the how to do
it as he went along.

1475
01:19:03,960 --> 01:19:07,480
And Mr. Richard said iron lungs
are very robust machines.

1476
01:19:07,480 --> 01:19:11,320
They're built to last, which is
good because the people in them

1477
01:19:11,320 --> 01:19:14,600
had been in them for lives their
whole lives.

1478
01:19:14,720 --> 01:19:17,600
And so Mr. Richard said it's
simple machine, though, and he

1479
01:19:17,600 --> 01:19:21,880
managed to work it out.
And so that was, that was good.

1480
01:19:22,240 --> 01:19:24,800
And he just happened to have
this reefer service machine

1481
01:19:24,800 --> 01:19:27,560
ready to go.
He swapped it for Paul's damaged

1482
01:19:27,560 --> 01:19:28,960
one.
And he wouldn't even accept any

1483
01:19:28,960 --> 01:19:30,800
money for the work.
He just said OK.

1484
01:19:31,280 --> 01:19:33,600
And so then I guess he probably
tinkered the other.

1485
01:19:33,920 --> 01:19:37,400
But they were saying, they were
saying in the article that

1486
01:19:37,400 --> 01:19:39,560
wasn't the end of the story.
The swap wasn't the end.

1487
01:19:39,640 --> 01:19:43,240
Later that night that that they
did the swap, Mr. Richards got a

1488
01:19:43,240 --> 01:19:48,240
call from from Paul's caregiver
saying the machine wasn't

1489
01:19:48,240 --> 01:19:50,760
working.
And so he came to Paul's

1490
01:19:50,760 --> 01:19:54,280
apartment and realized neck
collar wasn't on properly and

1491
01:19:54,280 --> 01:19:58,080
I'd come loose.
So he fixed it and and that was

1492
01:19:58,080 --> 01:20:00,320
good.
And Mr. Richardson said Paul was

1493
01:20:00,320 --> 01:20:02,360
saying the whole time, I'm fine,
I'm OK.

1494
01:20:03,160 --> 01:20:05,720
Even though he was turning blue
and he really couldn't breathe

1495
01:20:05,720 --> 01:20:07,800
very well.
But Paul was yeah, everything's

1496
01:20:07,800 --> 01:20:09,160
cool.
All, all things are good.

1497
01:20:09,320 --> 01:20:12,440
Paul did, though, have a
portable breathing device and

1498
01:20:12,440 --> 01:20:15,000
that was useful to him.
And that's what we talked about

1499
01:20:15,000 --> 01:20:17,320
with the port positive pressure
respirators.

1500
01:20:17,760 --> 01:20:20,680
The thing that is difficult
about that, Paul explained, was

1501
01:20:20,680 --> 01:20:22,880
that it made him feel like he
had his head sticking out the

1502
01:20:22,960 --> 01:20:26,520
the car window.
Where is this, you know, a big a

1503
01:20:26,520 --> 01:20:30,800
big breeze blowing at them.
And that was something that made

1504
01:20:30,800 --> 01:20:34,040
him feel uncomfortable.
So he never don't move full time

1505
01:20:34,040 --> 01:20:37,680
to those masks or anything like
that because he did not care for

1506
01:20:37,680 --> 01:20:40,280
it.
They do talk here and Paul died

1507
01:20:40,320 --> 01:20:45,040
just I believe it was last year
at 78, still in the iron lung.

1508
01:20:45,040 --> 01:20:49,160
Another person that they talked
about is a person who was in New

1509
01:20:49,160 --> 01:20:52,280
York and excuse me, in York and
northern England.

1510
01:20:52,320 --> 01:20:55,840
He did make the switch from the
iron lung to the portable

1511
01:20:55,840 --> 01:20:58,680
devices.
He was also infected the same

1512
01:20:58,680 --> 01:21:03,040
year as Paul was, which is an
interesting fact to me too.

1513
01:21:03,040 --> 01:21:03,920
Yeah.
It's like, wow.

1514
01:21:04,000 --> 01:21:06,960
The two and they were very close
to the same age.

1515
01:21:06,960 --> 01:21:09,200
He recovered to a point where he
could live his life without

1516
01:21:09,240 --> 01:21:12,960
significant breathing support.
But as he aged, he needed more

1517
01:21:12,960 --> 01:21:15,160
help.
So then he started using the

1518
01:21:15,160 --> 01:21:17,920
respirator really can help for
him.

1519
01:21:17,920 --> 01:21:23,200
James had said that he used the
respirator mask for 17 hours a

1520
01:21:23,200 --> 01:21:26,080
day and he doesn't remember much
about being in the iron lung, he

1521
01:21:26,080 --> 01:21:28,280
said.
He said he's also placed in head

1522
01:21:28,280 --> 01:21:31,680
to toe plaster cast initially
because because they thought

1523
01:21:31,680 --> 01:21:34,000
that would prevent the limbs
from becoming deformed.

1524
01:21:34,520 --> 01:21:38,000
So he's in an iron lung, in a
plaster cast, in a plastic full

1525
01:21:38,000 --> 01:21:41,000
body plaster cast.
Yes, yes.

1526
01:21:41,040 --> 01:21:45,720
Most, most awful.
Mr. Porteous James was had a

1527
01:21:45,720 --> 01:21:48,880
long career, too.
He was a stockbroker and he was

1528
01:21:48,920 --> 01:21:53,120
in various senior roles for a
business called Rowan Tree,

1529
01:21:53,120 --> 01:21:54,920
which later became part of
Nestle.

1530
01:21:54,920 --> 01:21:56,560
He was married, had four
daughters.

1531
01:21:56,560 --> 01:22:01,280
He traveled the world and it's
just, yeah, it's, it's just

1532
01:22:01,280 --> 01:22:03,080
amazing.
And one of the things like we

1533
01:22:03,080 --> 01:22:07,680
talked about is that he chose
this path, that he, he decided

1534
01:22:08,000 --> 01:22:10,400
I'm not just going to do that.
And he said, he was quoted

1535
01:22:10,400 --> 01:22:13,440
saying I could have sat all my
life with a rug over my knees,

1536
01:22:13,480 --> 01:22:15,440
but I decided just get on with
it.

1537
01:22:15,760 --> 01:22:18,440
I'm tired these days and I don't
get out much anymore, but life

1538
01:22:18,440 --> 01:22:20,200
is good.
I'm a nice family and good

1539
01:22:20,200 --> 01:22:21,880
friends.
One thing I'd still like to see

1540
01:22:21,880 --> 01:22:25,800
achieved in my lifetime is the
complete eradication of polio

1541
01:22:25,800 --> 01:22:28,840
around the world, man.
Yeah.

1542
01:22:28,960 --> 01:22:32,720
With Paul.
It ending polio also was his.

1543
01:22:32,720 --> 01:22:34,800
Ambition.
And Paul wrote about it in his

1544
01:22:34,800 --> 01:22:38,480
2020 memoir, which he typed
himself using a pencil attached

1545
01:22:38,480 --> 01:22:41,160
to a stick gripped in his mouth
to reach the computer keyboard.

1546
01:22:42,680 --> 01:22:45,280
Yeah.
Phillip, his Paul's brother,

1547
01:22:45,280 --> 01:22:49,080
said that after his Paul's book
was published, he fully realized

1548
01:22:49,080 --> 01:22:51,560
what an inspiration his brother
was to people around the world

1549
01:22:51,960 --> 01:22:54,880
because his personality had a
lot to do with how much he was

1550
01:22:54,880 --> 01:22:57,160
admired.
And he was always had a great

1551
01:22:57,160 --> 01:22:59,360
big smile.
He was welcoming one person, and

1552
01:22:59,360 --> 01:23:00,680
he used to make people
comfortable.

1553
01:23:00,720 --> 01:23:03,280
That was very huge.
When a person named Brady

1554
01:23:03,280 --> 01:23:06,840
Richards, who I referenced
before who had been involved in

1555
01:23:06,840 --> 01:23:10,760
his his care, said that it was
always a pleasure to be around

1556
01:23:10,760 --> 01:23:12,000
Paul.
He had a very upbeat and

1557
01:23:12,000 --> 01:23:14,920
positive attitude, attitude.
The fact that his parents took

1558
01:23:14,920 --> 01:23:20,000
their son home and a machine
that was at at the time really

1559
01:23:20,000 --> 01:23:24,960
high end technology they had,
they had no, I mean there was

1560
01:23:24,960 --> 01:23:27,000
very little training on it for
anyone.

1561
01:23:27,280 --> 01:23:30,520
But Paul also had a tracheostomy
which called for special care.

1562
01:23:30,880 --> 01:23:34,920
And so they basically had to be
their own engineers, nurses and

1563
01:23:34,920 --> 01:23:36,720
doctors.
They had to do it all.

1564
01:23:37,160 --> 01:23:42,440
And that is just the dedication
was amazing.

1565
01:23:43,080 --> 01:23:46,400
And Paul was recognized by the
Guinness World Records as the

1566
01:23:46,400 --> 01:23:48,960
person who lived in the longest
in iron lung.

1567
01:23:49,000 --> 01:23:52,880
He died, like I said, last year
at 78.

1568
01:23:52,880 --> 01:23:57,800
He was in the iron lung for over
70 years.

1569
01:23:59,240 --> 01:24:01,280
I know I just, I just don't
even.

1570
01:24:01,520 --> 01:24:05,320
And to have done so much as the
other man had said, James, I

1571
01:24:05,320 --> 01:24:08,080
could have just sat with a
blanket over my knees and just

1572
01:24:08,120 --> 01:24:10,240
done that and I it would have
been fine.

1573
01:24:10,240 --> 01:24:14,400
Nobody would have blamed him.
But they they fought to have as

1574
01:24:14,400 --> 01:24:16,360
normal a life as they possibly
could.

1575
01:24:16,880 --> 01:24:21,840
And that story about Paul and
his family's dedication and even

1576
01:24:21,840 --> 01:24:27,400
other people who have been in
similar situations is just, it

1577
01:24:27,400 --> 01:24:30,680
just kind of rocks my world.
And I wonder if I was really in

1578
01:24:30,680 --> 01:24:33,520
such a situation.
You know, we talked earlier

1579
01:24:33,520 --> 01:24:36,680
about just saying no peace out.
I'm not, I'm not going to do it.

1580
01:24:37,000 --> 01:24:41,400
But there are people who have
the fortitude to go through

1581
01:24:41,400 --> 01:24:45,560
these challenges in ways that
it's, I think a lot of us just

1582
01:24:45,560 --> 01:24:49,240
can't, can't relate to.
And, and granted, we haven't

1583
01:24:49,240 --> 01:24:51,760
been in the situation.
I mean, we've all been through

1584
01:24:51,760 --> 01:24:55,600
hard times and we've, we've come
out the other side one way or

1585
01:24:55,600 --> 01:24:58,080
another.
But when we look for me, when I

1586
01:24:58,080 --> 01:25:00,240
look at people that go through
stuff like this and then I look

1587
01:25:00,240 --> 01:25:02,480
at my challenges and I'm like,
yeah, that stuff, my stuff

1588
01:25:02,480 --> 01:25:07,320
wasn't that big a deal.
But then other people.

1589
01:25:07,320 --> 01:25:09,720
Look at our challenges and go,
how did they do it?

1590
01:25:09,720 --> 01:25:12,520
It's.
So I think, I think my point in

1591
01:25:12,520 --> 01:25:16,680
this rambling that I'm doing
here is just a people are

1592
01:25:16,800 --> 01:25:18,960
fighting their own wars.
They.

1593
01:25:19,000 --> 01:25:22,440
We all have something that we're
dealing with, and how we deal

1594
01:25:22,440 --> 01:25:26,920
with it is also something that
we decide on our own based on

1595
01:25:26,920 --> 01:25:29,120
our families or training and
things like that.

1596
01:25:29,120 --> 01:25:32,720
When we look at other people and
whatever status or state they're

1597
01:25:32,720 --> 01:25:37,840
in, that I just implore us all
to give each other the benefit

1598
01:25:37,840 --> 01:25:41,760
of the doubt, to give each other
the grace to do the things that

1599
01:25:41,760 --> 01:25:44,480
we need to do and to help as
much as we can.

1600
01:25:44,880 --> 01:25:48,880
Because that's to me, connecting
our communities, connecting our

1601
01:25:48,880 --> 01:25:53,560
world is, is what is so vital,
especially as we say, a lot of

1602
01:25:53,560 --> 01:25:56,920
times in in, in these times
where people feel so separated.

1603
01:25:57,320 --> 01:26:01,000
And I think if we can do that
just one person at a time, it's

1604
01:26:01,000 --> 01:26:04,560
going to make a difference.
So what do you think?

1605
01:26:04,920 --> 01:26:06,000
What do you think about all
this?

1606
01:26:06,000 --> 01:26:08,960
My heavens, it's a big deal.
Yeah, it's great.

1607
01:26:08,960 --> 01:26:11,080
It's a crazy story.
It's I.

1608
01:26:11,080 --> 01:26:17,720
Mean I just yeah, it's I'm very
impressed with I'm always very

1609
01:26:17,720 --> 01:26:22,120
impressed with people who get
dealt a bad hand and and play it

1610
01:26:22,120 --> 01:26:24,640
with grace, you know mm hmm mm
hmm.

1611
01:26:24,800 --> 01:26:30,600
Well, so here's to not.
Letting polio get rampant again.

1612
01:26:30,600 --> 01:26:34,720
And yeah, here's to let's maybe
think twice before.

1613
01:26:34,720 --> 01:26:38,400
We expose people to polio.
No, that's right.

1614
01:26:38,680 --> 01:26:40,480
Please don't expose people
Polio.

1615
01:26:40,840 --> 01:26:44,200
Anyway, well, thanks.
This was this was a a really

1616
01:26:44,200 --> 01:26:46,280
interesting topic.
I was going to use a fun topic.

1617
01:26:46,280 --> 01:26:50,800
No, it wasn't very fun, but it
was really interesting to delve

1618
01:26:50,800 --> 01:26:53,640
deep into it because it was
something I knew of

1619
01:26:53,640 --> 01:26:57,520
peripherally, but not really in
any deep kind of way.

1620
01:26:58,200 --> 01:27:00,080
So cool.
Well, thank you.

1621
01:27:00,120 --> 01:27:02,520
It was it was very interesting
topic.

1622
01:27:02,520 --> 01:27:04,480
I enjoyed it A.
Lot All right, if you've made it

1623
01:27:04,480 --> 01:27:07,120
this far, clearly you like a
little mayhem with your.

1624
01:27:07,120 --> 01:27:09,200
Medicine.
Or you just enjoy hearing us

1625
01:27:09,200 --> 01:27:11,040
ramble about weird medical
mysteries.

1626
01:27:11,360 --> 01:27:12,920
Either way.
We'd love you for it.

1627
01:27:13,160 --> 01:27:16,240
So hit that follow or subscribe
button wherever you're listening

1628
01:27:16,400 --> 01:27:18,080
and toss us.
A rating or review while you're

1629
01:27:18,080 --> 01:27:20,440
at it helps other curious
weirdos.

1630
01:27:20,440 --> 01:27:24,080
Find the show and we know there
are a lot of you out there.

1631
01:27:24,400 --> 01:27:26,960
Oh, so many.
Come join the chaos.

1632
01:27:26,960 --> 01:27:30,120
Thanks for listening to.
Medicine, mystery, mayhem and

1633
01:27:30,120 --> 01:27:31,080
sometimes.
Murder.

1634
01:27:31,640 --> 01:27:34,200
Do you have an idea for an
episode of this podcast?

1635
01:27:34,600 --> 01:27:37,240
Just want to say.
Hi, you can get in touch with us

1636
01:27:37,240 --> 01:27:46,040
at our M4 pod that's OURM
thenumberfourpod@gmail.com.

1637
01:27:46,720 --> 01:27:50,520
We read every e-mail and
sometimes we even respond just

1638
01:27:50,520 --> 01:27:55,120
like real professionals because
we are old friends with new

1639
01:27:55,120 --> 01:27:58,200
twists and lots of body bags.