She's a Rainbow

1
00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:11,360
Welcome to M4 Medicine, mystery,
mayhem, and sometimes murder.

2
00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:14,920
I'm Andrea Marciano and RN with
35 years of experience across

3
00:00:14,920 --> 00:00:17,080
various fields.
From direct patient care in

4
00:00:17,080 --> 00:00:19,800
hospitals to home health,
geriatrics, and injury medicine,

5
00:00:20,080 --> 00:00:22,200
I face life, death, and
everything in between.

6
00:00:22,240 --> 00:00:25,720
And I'm Crystal Miller and RN
with 13 1/2 years of experience.

7
00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:28,960
My work spans home health,
Hospice, emergency care,

8
00:00:28,960 --> 00:00:30,680
geriatrics, and occupational
health.

9
00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:33,640
From the chaos of trauma based
quiet moments with patients,

10
00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:35,920
I've seen stories that defy
explanations.

11
00:00:36,160 --> 00:00:39,720
We've been friends for over 25
years and as nurses we've shared

12
00:00:39,720 --> 00:00:44,040
countless stories that have left
us and our families speechless.

13
00:00:44,040 --> 00:00:47,120
Now we're bringing those stories
and many more to you in

14
00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:51,240
medicine, mystery, mayhem, and
sometimes murder.

15
00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:54,840
Each week, we'll uncover cases
that challenge the boundaries of

16
00:00:54,840 --> 00:00:57,400
medicine, sharing the human
stories behind the science.

17
00:00:57,400 --> 00:01:00,320
From puzzling medical mysteries
to shocking real life crimes,

18
00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:03,040
we'll bring you stories that'll
leave you questioning everything

19
00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:04,959
you thought you knew.
While we're both experienced

20
00:01:04,959 --> 00:01:07,680
nurses, we want to make make it
clear we're not here to give

21
00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:09,800
medical advice.
This podcast is about

22
00:01:09,800 --> 00:01:13,120
storytelling, education and
exploration, not diagnosing or

23
00:01:13,120 --> 00:01:16,920
treating medical conditions.
This is medicine, mystery,

24
00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:20,840
mayhem and sometimes murder.
Let's dive in.

25
00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:23,000
Hey Crystal, how are you today?
I'm doing well.

26
00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:24,560
How are you?
I am very well.

27
00:01:24,560 --> 00:01:27,840
Thank you very much.
Would you like to hear about my

28
00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:30,480
near death experience?
Oh yes, definitely.

29
00:01:30,600 --> 00:01:32,800
OK, and I'm not being dramatic
at all.

30
00:01:33,040 --> 00:01:36,200
OK, maybe a little bit.
Have you ever seen a paper

31
00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:37,240
wasp's nest?
Don't.

32
00:01:37,400 --> 00:01:40,880
Even know what that is?
OK, well, a paper wasp nest is

33
00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:43,760
kind of like what you might
expect is it's a nest that's

34
00:01:43,760 --> 00:01:46,280
built.
It's not actual paper, but it

35
00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:50,920
looks like paper and it's kind
of wrapped and it's, it's really

36
00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:55,480
an interesting looking thing.
However, it's super scary

37
00:01:56,160 --> 00:01:58,360
because that means it's full of
Wasps.

38
00:01:58,760 --> 00:02:00,000
Well, we have these.
Yikes.

39
00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:05,400
Yeah, we have these planter
boxes in the yard and the.

40
00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:10,320
I was pulling some weeds the
other day and I leaned over and

41
00:02:10,320 --> 00:02:13,600
to get into it's just, it's a
big planter.

42
00:02:13,720 --> 00:02:17,160
It's basically a through and I
was leaning into it so I could

43
00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:21,760
reach across because we all know
I have T Rex arms and can't

44
00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:23,400
reach very far.
And I was too lazy to walk

45
00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:25,560
around.
And when I leaned against the

46
00:02:25,600 --> 00:02:28,640
planter, I heard buzzing.
I'm like, oh shoot, what's that?

47
00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:31,880
Well, I leaned back and I had
just been leaning on a paper

48
00:02:31,880 --> 00:02:34,800
wasp mask, which will hold
hundreds if not thousands of

49
00:02:34,800 --> 00:02:38,560
Wasps.
And fortunately, I guess the way

50
00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:40,600
I leaned against it, they
weren't that agitated, but they

51
00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:43,760
were starting to get agitated.
So I walked away quickly because

52
00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:46,560
Wasps, I'm allergic to wasp.
I think most people are at least

53
00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:49,480
very sensitive to them and all
their sudden hurt.

54
00:02:50,360 --> 00:02:52,600
Now they do.
And I know I'm allergic, like I

55
00:02:52,600 --> 00:02:54,680
say.
And so I backed up as quickly as

56
00:02:54,680 --> 00:02:57,480
I can because as soon as I saw
the nest, I knew what it was.

57
00:02:57,480 --> 00:03:01,120
And then I saw wasp just, I
don't know how flying.

58
00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:03,360
I was going to say storming out.
I don't know if that's the right

59
00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:04,960
word.
It felt like it.

60
00:03:04,960 --> 00:03:08,480
They come charging out and
they're flying everywhere, all

61
00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:11,000
around that space.
And I was far enough away that

62
00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:12,360
there were some that were coming
closer.

63
00:03:12,360 --> 00:03:15,080
So of course I backed up because
I didn't want to be too close at

64
00:03:15,080 --> 00:03:17,600
all.
But then of course, I told my

65
00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:19,560
partner Max that it was out
there.

66
00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:22,160
And of course believe that's a
man's job.

67
00:03:23,320 --> 00:03:25,440
He's not allergic.
He doesn't like them, but he's

68
00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:27,680
not allergic.
So it it does make sense that he

69
00:03:27,680 --> 00:03:31,040
would take care of it versus me.
And he went over and that's one

70
00:03:31,040 --> 00:03:34,520
thing that we have no
compunction of poisoning because

71
00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:36,800
they just have no positive
contribution.

72
00:03:37,320 --> 00:03:40,160
I've even looked it up.
If there's something that Wasps

73
00:03:40,200 --> 00:03:43,000
do that is good and I didn't see
anything.

74
00:03:43,640 --> 00:03:46,800
So they must be good for
something, but I don't know what

75
00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:49,280
it is.
He went and sprayed it active

76
00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:51,080
during the day.
And so he sprayed it during the

77
00:03:51,080 --> 00:03:53,520
day because they were flying
around and the poison is pretty

78
00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:55,920
strong.
Then he went out again at night

79
00:03:55,920 --> 00:03:59,800
and I went out this morning
again and there were two Wasps

80
00:03:59,800 --> 00:04:02,400
there, but that was all.
But we'll still probably spray

81
00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:06,880
one more time because there's,
we don't know if the queen got

82
00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:10,560
killed or what, but the wasp
nest itself had all fallen

83
00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:12,000
apart.
I don't know if it's because it

84
00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:14,720
got wet from the spray or what,
but oh, they give me the

85
00:04:14,720 --> 00:04:17,880
willies.
Me too me, I've only been stung

86
00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:20,480
by a wasp once and it hurts so
bad.

87
00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:23,680
Mm hmm that is good.
I didn't know I was allergic

88
00:04:23,680 --> 00:04:27,600
until I was in my late 20s.
I was doing some yard work with

89
00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:32,520
my ex mother-in-law and you knew
I said we saw some Wasps in the

90
00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:34,240
area.
And I said listen, if I get

91
00:04:34,240 --> 00:04:36,960
stung by a wasp, I don't care
what I tell you.

92
00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:41,800
You call 911 if I start acting
crazy, because if I get stung, I

93
00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:43,840
knew I'd go in and get Benadryl
right away.

94
00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:46,480
But I said, if I start acting
weird, anything seems off, you

95
00:04:46,480 --> 00:04:49,600
call 911 because I'm probably
having an allergic reaction.

96
00:04:50,040 --> 00:04:53,960
And so then of course,
immediately thereafter, 2 Wasps

97
00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:59,320
stung me on the back of my hand.
My, my hand doubled in size up

98
00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:02,480
to the elbow within minutes.
And so I went in and I took a

99
00:05:02,480 --> 00:05:06,960
whole slew of Benadryl and some
Zyrtec also, which you know, is

100
00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:09,760
not proper dosing.
So I'm not supporting that plan.

101
00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:15,000
However, I'd rather have too
much antihistamine then go into

102
00:05:15,000 --> 00:05:17,680
anaphylaxis.
And so then she kept looking at

103
00:05:17,680 --> 00:05:19,720
me and she said, are you OK?
Is everything all right?

104
00:05:19,720 --> 00:05:22,160
I said I'm fine.
And she said I know, but are you

105
00:05:22,160 --> 00:05:23,520
saying that because you're crazy
now?

106
00:05:23,520 --> 00:05:24,800
Or are you saying that because
it's true?

107
00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:28,640
She didn't know what she didn't
know what to do, which is fair

108
00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:31,760
because it was it was a weird
situation.

109
00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:34,520
So I took myself out of the
environment and I just stayed in

110
00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:37,840
the house where it was cool and,
and I obviously lived through

111
00:05:37,840 --> 00:05:40,160
it, but she was so funny.
But how do I know if you're

112
00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:45,000
crazy now like I say, she had a
valid point.

113
00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:49,440
It was a surprising, it was
surprising me to how quickly my

114
00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:53,920
tissues reacted.
I know that most, well not most,

115
00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:56,320
but many allergies are
progressive.

116
00:05:56,320 --> 00:05:59,800
So you may have a response now
that's this much and then it may

117
00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:02,200
progressively increase to
anaphylaxis.

118
00:06:02,400 --> 00:06:05,720
I didn't know which how soon
that would happen for me, so

119
00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:08,520
didn't want to wonder anyway.
So that was my near death

120
00:06:08,520 --> 00:06:10,560
experience, which wasn't really
this time.

121
00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:14,120
It was probably closer to a near
death experience the other time

122
00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:17,600
I was telling you about.
But they're still I don't like

123
00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:18,960
them.
Yeah, I don't either.

124
00:06:19,280 --> 00:06:21,640
They're ugly also.
Like they're just yucky.

125
00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:24,360
They are, but fortunately not.
Things aren't very often

126
00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:27,520
described on whether something's
beneficial based on beauty.

127
00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:30,000
Because I don't know who's
judging and I don't want to be

128
00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:31,920
on the wrong end of that stick.
Yeah, no kidding.

129
00:06:33,520 --> 00:06:38,960
Well, she was too ugly.
So anyway.

130
00:06:39,840 --> 00:06:44,320
Well, today I have two things
I'm going to talk about, and

131
00:06:44,320 --> 00:06:49,240
both are skin conditions which
can be really unpleasant and

132
00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:50,480
unsettling.
True.

133
00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:53,600
I'll talk about the first one
and the sources related to that,

134
00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:56,200
and then I'll talk about the
second one and the sources

135
00:06:56,360 --> 00:06:58,560
related to that.
Have you ever heard of

136
00:06:58,560 --> 00:07:01,120
Morgellon's disease?
I don't think so.

137
00:07:01,360 --> 00:07:04,840
I hadn't either until we we made
our list of the things that we

138
00:07:04,840 --> 00:07:07,320
wanted to talk about.
That's what the first thing I'm

139
00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:10,000
going to cover is, is
Morgellon's disease.

140
00:07:10,360 --> 00:07:15,360
And my sources for it are from
the Annuals of dermatology from

141
00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:20,720
the National Library of Medicine
and the Medical News Today

142
00:07:20,720 --> 00:07:25,680
article about the Morgellon's
disease, as many things is a

143
00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:28,200
rare, it's a rare condition.
And that's really fortunate

144
00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:32,880
because it seems unpleasant at
vest is considered rare and it's

145
00:07:32,880 --> 00:07:35,360
poorly understood.
And it's a condition that's

146
00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:37,840
characterized by chronic skin
lesions.

147
00:07:38,280 --> 00:07:40,560
The thing that's different about
it than some of the other

148
00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:46,040
chronic skin conditions is that
it may contain fibers of various

149
00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:49,880
colors in the lesions.
So it's interesting because

150
00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:52,920
after we finished, I'll I'll ask
you what you think about it.

151
00:07:52,920 --> 00:07:56,040
But I still have mixed feelings
about the condition generally.

152
00:07:56,040 --> 00:07:57,920
But let me tell you some more
about it.

153
00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:03,200
OK, individual individuals with
Morgellons often report symptoms

154
00:08:03,200 --> 00:08:05,840
such as crawling sensations on
the skin, right?

155
00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:08,920
That alone, listeners, you can't
see a crystal shudder.

156
00:08:08,920 --> 00:08:12,080
But she was shuddering, and so
did I when I was reading some of

157
00:08:12,080 --> 00:08:13,960
this.
They also complain of joint and

158
00:08:13,960 --> 00:08:16,360
muscle pain and cognitive
issues.

159
00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:18,800
OK.
So that's an interesting

160
00:08:18,800 --> 00:08:20,240
constellation of symptoms, isn't
it?

161
00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:22,560
Yeah, it really is.
So we're going to go more into

162
00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:25,720
detail about the symptoms, but
those are the ones that are sort

163
00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:29,560
of the beginning.
Now the medical consensus is

164
00:08:30,040 --> 00:08:37,440
that Morgellons is a form of
delusional parasitosis, right?

165
00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:40,080
Hold that thought and we're
going to go into it a little bit

166
00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:44,280
more.
But what it says is that in this

167
00:08:44,560 --> 00:08:48,400
delusional parasitosis,
parasitosis, gosh, I said it

168
00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:50,080
once correctly.
I don't know if they will again.

169
00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:53,720
The patients believe that
they're infested with parasites

170
00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:56,080
or foreign materials.
Treatments are not well

171
00:08:56,240 --> 00:08:59,680
established because if it's
something that the patient only

172
00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:02,240
leaves, is it real?
Right.

173
00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:04,960
Yeah, hold that thought.
OK.

174
00:09:05,320 --> 00:09:08,440
The management of the symptoms
usually just focus on the

175
00:09:08,440 --> 00:09:10,680
symptom itself.
So you're super itchy, Maybe you

176
00:09:10,680 --> 00:09:12,560
get Benadryl or something like
that.

177
00:09:12,600 --> 00:09:15,480
We have to try carefully
sometimes because a lot of

178
00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:18,360
people believe there are
underlying psychological aspects

179
00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:20,120
of this illness.
Uh huh.

180
00:09:20,200 --> 00:09:22,600
OK.
OK, but is that all it is?

181
00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:24,720
Well, the.
Fact that the first word is

182
00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:29,360
delusions, right?
Makes me question if that's all

183
00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:30,960
it is, you know?
Right.

184
00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:34,600
I'm still not sure, but listen
to what I found out, OK?

185
00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:41,320
This disease causes black,
white, red or blue fibers to

186
00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:43,920
appear under the skin or
protrude from it.

187
00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:47,480
OK, And those are the colors.
It's not like you can find a

188
00:09:47,480 --> 00:09:49,960
purple 1.
You can't find a yellow one.

189
00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:56,000
It's black, white, red or blue.
OK, So given that, is that

190
00:09:56,000 --> 00:09:58,640
psychological?
I mean, does a Magellan suffer

191
00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:00,760
in Asia know that a Magellan
suffer?

192
00:10:00,760 --> 00:10:04,160
And Kenya comes to mind, not for
any particular reason, but do

193
00:10:04,160 --> 00:10:07,240
they know that it's supposed to
be black, white, red or blue

194
00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:08,720
fibers?
How would they know?

195
00:10:08,880 --> 00:10:11,120
How could that be connected?
If people are reporting in

196
00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:13,160
different areas, how can they
have the same colors?

197
00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:16,040
That's one of the things that
that brings question to my mind.

198
00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:19,120
And again, people also feel like
something is crawling under

199
00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:21,400
their skin.
I've seen enough bizarre ER with

200
00:10:21,400 --> 00:10:23,360
people saying they felt
something under their skin and

201
00:10:23,360 --> 00:10:26,880
people said they were
wackadoodle that I still hold a

202
00:10:26,880 --> 00:10:29,840
grain of salt with all of this.
But again, it remains A

203
00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:33,400
controversial topic because
people are just not sure because

204
00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:37,040
there's so few people involved
and the people involved, there's

205
00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:38,840
very little information about
it.

206
00:10:38,840 --> 00:10:43,360
There's been some some studies,
but because there are so few

207
00:10:43,360 --> 00:10:48,200
people, it's hard to study with
any reliability because there's

208
00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:51,120
just very few people.
And I'm going to put in our chat

209
00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:55,080
a picture of this disorder
Crystal.

210
00:10:55,280 --> 00:11:00,160
In this picture, it's a
magnified picture of a lesion

211
00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:03,520
that someone had.
Can you see anything specific in

212
00:11:03,520 --> 00:11:04,680
it?
Blue.

213
00:11:04,960 --> 00:11:06,120
Yeah.
Blue strands, right?

214
00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:08,920
Yeah, Yeah.
They look like threads and, and

215
00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:10,760
some of it, there's some red as
well.

216
00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:14,440
And the tissue generally just
looks unhealthy and it looks

217
00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:18,040
quite waxy to me as well.
I don't know if you can see all

218
00:11:18,040 --> 00:11:20,760
that in the picture I sent since
the picture was of poor quality

219
00:11:20,760 --> 00:11:22,840
that I sent you.
This is something that that was

220
00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:26,160
found on microscope on one of
the people that was complaining

221
00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:29,840
of the syndrome.
What do you think could possibly

222
00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:32,360
be the treatment for this
disorder?

223
00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:36,920
I mean, I personally want to
take a tweezer and pull the

224
00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:38,200
strands out, right?
What?

225
00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:40,840
They are, Yeah.
That would be definitely

226
00:11:40,840 --> 00:11:42,520
tempting.
But you're also the one who

227
00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:45,960
likes to pop zits and stuff.
Then I just assume leave it

228
00:11:45,960 --> 00:11:49,760
alone, cover it and make it come
out on its own things out of

229
00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:52,240
people I know.
I'm a nurse of 30, almost.

230
00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:54,680
Well, six years now.
And no, thank you.

231
00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:58,320
Anyway, as we discussed before,
there's really no standard

232
00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:00,440
treatment because everybody
approaches things.

233
00:12:00,560 --> 00:12:02,520
Every provider approaches things
differently.

234
00:12:02,560 --> 00:12:05,480
The patient has some
similarities, but they don't

235
00:12:05,480 --> 00:12:08,520
always have the same symptoms.
And some doctors recommend

236
00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:12,240
antibiotic therapy if they
believe the condition is due to

237
00:12:12,240 --> 00:12:16,560
a bacterial infection.
Because if you can imagine with

238
00:12:16,560 --> 00:12:20,480
these, these lesions and
discomfort and they're not

239
00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:23,520
healing, I'm sure people touch
them a lot and they scratch them

240
00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:26,200
a lot.
So if bacteria wasn't initially

241
00:12:26,200 --> 00:12:29,600
involved, I'm pretty sure it
would become involved because

242
00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:32,520
there's no way people could
have, you know, multiple lesions

243
00:12:32,600 --> 00:12:36,560
without having some staph
potentially that is already on

244
00:12:36,560 --> 00:12:40,240
our skin going into the lesions.
And I imagine this can get

245
00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:45,800
pretty pretty bad.
Other doctors use topical

246
00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:49,720
antibiotics as well for the long
lasting, lasting skin lesions

247
00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:52,920
because if they haven't already
become infected or turned into

248
00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:55,840
Cellulitis, for heaven's sakes,
the long lasting lesions

249
00:12:55,840 --> 00:12:58,440
probably have a high propensity
for that.

250
00:12:58,720 --> 00:13:01,480
But then you would look into the
potential complications of

251
00:13:01,480 --> 00:13:05,160
having chronic use of
antibacterial on the skin or

252
00:13:05,160 --> 00:13:07,800
even maybe some doctors might
try steroids.

253
00:13:08,080 --> 00:13:11,440
Long term use of steroids has
some pretty significant systemic

254
00:13:11,440 --> 00:13:15,040
impact as well.
Now, if you went into the doctor

255
00:13:15,040 --> 00:13:18,400
and you had lesions that you
thought you saw strands of fiber

256
00:13:18,520 --> 00:13:22,080
growing in them, especially if
you can't get the fiber out, and

257
00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:25,000
you walked into the doctor's
office and they said, well, this

258
00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:27,040
is psychiatric.
Right, it's all you had.

259
00:13:27,560 --> 00:13:31,360
How do you think you would feel?
I would probably be furious and

260
00:13:31,360 --> 00:13:34,720
feel very betrayed and
disrespected.

261
00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:38,280
Yeah, and I was watching.
I don't know if you ever watched

262
00:13:38,640 --> 00:13:40,560
the Doctor Pimple Popper of.
Course I do.

263
00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:44,040
I know you did.
I figured I rarely watch it

264
00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:47,160
because I can't take it, but
there was a woman who went in

265
00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:51,000
that I wondered if she could
have been diagnosed with this

266
00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:56,480
disorder because of her lesions.
Now she had lesions all over her

267
00:13:56,480 --> 00:13:59,160
body, and she gone to several
doctors who said, yeah, this is

268
00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:02,000
psychiatric, so you need to get
counseling.

269
00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:04,240
Well, she went to Doctor Pimple
Popper.

270
00:14:04,320 --> 00:14:05,840
What's her name?
Do you remember?

271
00:14:05,840 --> 00:14:08,880
Sandra Lee.
OK, Doctor Lee, I only

272
00:14:08,960 --> 00:14:11,560
recognized because I haven't
watched it that many times, went

273
00:14:11,560 --> 00:14:15,760
into Doctor Lee and Doctor Lee
looked at this woman and

274
00:14:15,760 --> 00:14:18,640
discovered that all of her
lesions were in areas that this

275
00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:21,200
woman could reach.
Which of course, brought up a

276
00:14:21,200 --> 00:14:24,760
big red flag because if a
person's going to have lesions

277
00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:29,280
that are not self-inflicted,
they're less likely to be only

278
00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:32,320
where a person can reach.
Now, the people with Magellans

279
00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:35,480
tend to have them over their
bodies, but this woman had it

280
00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:38,520
where she could reach.
And Doctor Lee did have to say,

281
00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:41,160
I'm sorry.
It really does seem to be

282
00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:43,800
psychiatric or especially stress
related.

283
00:14:44,120 --> 00:14:47,600
And when people hear psychiatric
problems, they all of a sudden

284
00:14:47,600 --> 00:14:50,160
think, well, now you're telling
me I'm just crazy and I'm making

285
00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:52,840
this up.
And that's not the same thing,

286
00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:55,840
right?
I mean, a psychiatric concern

287
00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:58,400
and being crazy, Well, what is
crazy anyway?

288
00:14:58,400 --> 00:15:01,480
I don't know.
But a psychiatric concern can be

289
00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:06,080
anxiety, it could be stress, it
could be whatever it could be.

290
00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:08,760
And does that mean that you will
always and forever be that way?

291
00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:10,920
Not necessarily.
Doesn't mean there's something

292
00:15:10,920 --> 00:15:15,200
you get to deal with.
Probably because most of us have

293
00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:18,520
some sort of air quote disorder,
if you will.

294
00:15:18,520 --> 00:15:20,360
When we're stressed, we'll do
something.

295
00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:24,080
When I'm super stressed, I, I
eat very little just because my

296
00:15:24,080 --> 00:15:26,240
stomach gets upset.
I just don't want to deal with

297
00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:28,720
it blah blah blah.
Other people eat a lot when they

298
00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:31,080
get stressed.
Some people have more physical

299
00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:34,560
things they do they'll some
people will do self harm, which

300
00:15:34,560 --> 00:15:38,160
this whole whole lesion thing
could fall into, I suppose in

301
00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:40,600
the self harm range.
I mean, people have all kinds of

302
00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:44,000
different things and if a
condition like that is going on

303
00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:46,760
for any period of time, it can
have some very serious health

304
00:15:46,760 --> 00:15:48,800
concerns.
Obviously if I stopped eating

305
00:15:48,800 --> 00:15:50,680
forever, well, I get skinny, so
that's.

306
00:15:51,720 --> 00:15:56,720
However, it's not a good plan
for longevity because at a point

307
00:15:56,720 --> 00:15:59,880
my body would need calories in
most cases.

308
00:15:59,880 --> 00:16:03,040
Most of us have stress episodes
that start and end in a

309
00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:06,120
reasonable time frame, I would
say before it causes severe

310
00:16:06,120 --> 00:16:09,120
health consequences.
But in these cases, if it is

311
00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:12,920
considered to be a psychiatric
disorder, people are put on

312
00:16:12,920 --> 00:16:16,080
antipsychotic drugs.
What's concerning about that is

313
00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:20,040
many people, if they go on
antipsychotic drugs, don't

314
00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:24,360
follow the drug regime very well
or even long enough to get any

315
00:16:24,360 --> 00:16:27,480
real results because many of
them have side effects.

316
00:16:27,480 --> 00:16:29,080
Many of them are difficult to
take.

317
00:16:29,400 --> 00:16:32,080
Many people have the feeling of
being a zombie or something like

318
00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:35,480
that.
And also because they feel that

319
00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:39,000
they're being called Aircote
crazy, they get even more upset

320
00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:41,960
and may even cause more problems
to themselves because of it.

321
00:16:42,040 --> 00:16:44,320
It's really a difficult
disorder.

322
00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:46,840
Psychological or physical, it
really doesn't matter.

323
00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:51,560
It's a difficult disorder.
Now, again, the cause remains

324
00:16:51,560 --> 00:16:53,880
unclear.
And also, like I said, the

325
00:16:53,880 --> 00:16:57,520
scientific community is divided
between who who believes it's a

326
00:16:57,520 --> 00:17:00,880
real thing and who believes due
to some sort of pathogen or

327
00:17:00,880 --> 00:17:02,720
something like that versus
psychological.

328
00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:06,200
There's been a couple of
research studies to discern it.

329
00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:10,040
Is it a psychiatric or
delusional mental illness or is

330
00:17:10,040 --> 00:17:13,400
it something else?
The providers I use providers

331
00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:16,240
because I prefer that to
healthcare professionals because

332
00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:17,920
they can look in so many
different ways.

333
00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:21,160
That's just my personal thing.
They're feeling like if it is a

334
00:17:21,160 --> 00:17:24,960
psychiatric or delusional mental
illness, then the fibers present

335
00:17:25,079 --> 00:17:28,280
under the skin are coming from
fabrics and test textiles.

336
00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:30,280
Sure.
The thing that's interesting to

337
00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:34,120
me though is not all fabrics are
the colors listed.

338
00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:37,000
Black, red, blue?
What green?

339
00:17:37,160 --> 00:17:40,800
I can't remember now, but the.
Color white and blue.

340
00:17:40,800 --> 00:17:43,760
It was like the patriarch.
Yellow or is it yes.

341
00:17:43,760 --> 00:17:46,880
Well, anyway, whatever it is,
they why is it just those

342
00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:49,320
colors, right?
Maybe they're dark colors, so

343
00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:52,080
that could make sense, but what
about the other dark colors?

344
00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:54,040
Who knows?
Anyway, that's the thing that

345
00:17:54,040 --> 00:17:59,120
makes me wonder is, and also I
wear clothes most of the time I

346
00:17:59,120 --> 00:18:02,480
don't get fibers, but then also
I don't have open wounds.

347
00:18:02,880 --> 00:18:05,520
But have you ever had an open
wound that did get a fibre in

348
00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:06,680
it?
Not that I'm aware of.

349
00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:10,440
Yeah, I don't think it's that
easy, but I'm not sure.

350
00:18:10,440 --> 00:18:13,080
The only thing I can think of is
you know how sometimes you get

351
00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:16,600
scrapes, not necessarily in it,
right, because it's a shallow,

352
00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:19,040
it's barely probably on the
first or second layer of skin.

353
00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:21,600
It's just one of those things
that if you don't cover it, just

354
00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:24,040
sometimes you know, it weeps.
I'm thinking like you fell off

355
00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:25,800
your bike and scrape type thing,
right?

356
00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:28,480
Right.
And, and it's maybe even if you

357
00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:31,040
had your clothes, I mean your
your clothes on instead of that

358
00:18:31,040 --> 00:18:34,240
naked bike riding, if you had
something like your blue jeans

359
00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:37,640
on and you got a a scrape with a
blue Jean and maybe the material

360
00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:39,600
even got embedded a little bit.
Yeah.

361
00:18:39,640 --> 00:18:41,240
Yeah.
But even that I don't, I don't

362
00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:44,080
remember having that experience.
It's just that's just

363
00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:46,680
theoretical and that it could
possibly happen that way.

364
00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:49,560
And yeah, yeah.
And very rarely, I know that

365
00:18:49,560 --> 00:18:53,960
people have had hairs actually
work their way into their skin

366
00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:58,240
like like a sliver, but it's
still not multiple in multiple

367
00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:01,960
locations all at one time.
I've never heard of that.

368
00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:06,480
And I guess maybe some people
maybe have thinner skin, but

369
00:19:06,640 --> 00:19:08,440
what was?
And it's true, as the person

370
00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:11,360
gets older, the skin is
considered air quotes thinner,

371
00:19:11,360 --> 00:19:14,320
but it's because there's less
collagen as a buffer.

372
00:19:14,360 --> 00:19:18,000
Not that the skin itself is
thinner per SE, but the

373
00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:22,440
protective layers are thinner
because as we get older, there's

374
00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:25,560
literally no upside.
I mean, wait, did I say that out

375
00:19:25,560 --> 00:19:26,840
loud?
I'm not Come on.

376
00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:32,080
OK, maybe there's an upside.
Listeners, please tell us what

377
00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:35,920
it is anyway.
So here's our here's some more

378
00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:39,640
information about it.
In 2012, researchers from the

379
00:19:39,640 --> 00:19:43,920
Centers from Disease Control and
Prevention examined 115 people

380
00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:45,800
with symptoms of Magellan's
disease.

381
00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:48,800
So small study, true, but we do
know it's rare.

382
00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:52,320
So that actually seemed in that
regard kind of a big group for

383
00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:57,040
me because it I never saw
anything about, even though they

384
00:19:57,040 --> 00:20:00,360
say it's a small group of people
or it's a rare thing, I never

385
00:20:00,360 --> 00:20:02,680
saw anything about how many
people are affected.

386
00:20:02,760 --> 00:20:04,400
I mean, it's probably out there
somewhere.

387
00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:09,480
But anyway, this 115 people went
in for this evaluation and the

388
00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:12,440
clinical team, they analyzed the
skin and blood samples, reviewed

389
00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:14,280
the medical history of each
participant.

390
00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:17,800
However, they didn't find a
common underlying medical

391
00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:20,480
condition or infectious agents
among them.

392
00:20:20,560 --> 00:20:24,480
So nobody had anything medical
or infectious in common at all.

393
00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:26,880
So it was CDCI.
Imagine these were all people.

394
00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:30,240
From the United States so they
could get them together.

395
00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:33,280
They did.
The scientists did report that

396
00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:37,880
43% of the biopsied skin had
fibrous material in at least one

397
00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:39,760
skin lesion.
Did I say Legion?

398
00:20:39,880 --> 00:20:43,480
Yeah, you did.
Pardon me, one skin lesion.

399
00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:45,600
I was like that.
Sounded like I said that

400
00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:49,640
incorrectly.
Anyway, 1 skin lesion had at

401
00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:52,400
least one skin lesion had a
fibrous thing in it.

402
00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:55,680
After further analysis, they
concluded that most fiber

403
00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:59,000
samples contain cotton.
However, they identified

404
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:02,080
bacteria or fungi in 19 people
Earlier.

405
00:21:02,080 --> 00:21:05,920
They said they had no infectious
agent that was consistent among

406
00:21:05,920 --> 00:21:08,160
them.
So that made me think, does that

407
00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:12,120
mean that these bacteria, fungi
were different in each of the 19

408
00:21:12,120 --> 00:21:14,280
people?
Each person had some different

409
00:21:14,280 --> 00:21:17,240
kind of bacteria or something.
It didn't clarify it in the

410
00:21:17,240 --> 00:21:19,320
study.
But to be honest, dear

411
00:21:19,320 --> 00:21:22,480
listeners, I didn't read the
entire study word for words, but

412
00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:26,280
this was this was the summary of
it and I saw something similar

413
00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:29,880
to it in another things that
someone had hypothesized is that

414
00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:33,880
these people who have this
disorder may have had Lyme

415
00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:36,360
disease and the bacteria that
comes with that.

416
00:21:36,720 --> 00:21:40,280
It's still probably the most
common hypothesis is that

417
00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:44,520
somehow Lyme disease can lead to
some of these things.

418
00:21:44,680 --> 00:21:48,560
Nobody nobody sure though.
But they did have a study that

419
00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:54,880
that was spoken of in 2017 that
there was a 30 year old woman

420
00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:59,960
who claimed she had morgue
disease and she had lesions on

421
00:21:59,960 --> 00:22:03,520
her arms, hands, chin, and they
had lasted for two months.

422
00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:07,280
And they also had a fibrous
projection under her skin.

423
00:22:07,360 --> 00:22:11,720
So it was multiple lesions had
fibrous projection.

424
00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:15,360
And she didn't sign show any
sign of Lyme disease either,

425
00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:19,040
which again was something they
just thought, gosh, could this

426
00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:21,920
have something to do with it?
Because it's since in some

427
00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:25,000
places some of the researchers
felt like Lyme disease was

428
00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:27,720
indicated, but there was no
strong proof than anything that

429
00:22:27,720 --> 00:22:33,120
I saw.
But then again, in a 2015 study,

430
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:40,240
the bacteria in Lyme diseases is
B burgdorferi and 24 out of the

431
00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:45,960
25 participants from Morgellons
had this bacteria in the study

432
00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:49,440
in 2015.
But that wasn't true in the

433
00:22:49,440 --> 00:22:55,120
study of 2017 or 12.
This is just making it as clear

434
00:22:55,120 --> 00:22:56,760
as mud, right?
Clearer and clearer.

435
00:22:56,760 --> 00:22:59,560
The more we go into it the more
well, what are you talking

436
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:02,240
about?
They also in this study in 2015

437
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:06,080
that the 24 out of 25
participants had this bacteria.

438
00:23:06,360 --> 00:23:10,000
They found that many of these
lesions that were taking a skin

439
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:12,560
samples contained fiber like
materials.

440
00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:16,040
I can see why the General
Medical population is going.

441
00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:18,760
We don't know because this is
like so many things.

442
00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:21,680
It's like, well, you say, yes,
you say all these ticks, tick

443
00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:23,680
boxes are checked.
And then somebody else says,

444
00:23:23,680 --> 00:23:27,840
well, no, they're not.
But but one of the things that

445
00:23:28,040 --> 00:23:32,040
after the the 2015 study did
some further analysis, the

446
00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:36,160
researchers said they concluded
that the fibers contained human

447
00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:38,440
cells.
If you think of that, they're

448
00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:40,560
cotton.
And they're human, right?

449
00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:43,760
Aliens, right?
Exactly.

450
00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:46,680
And when I looked at that
picture of the one I sent you,

451
00:23:47,120 --> 00:23:50,760
those look like fibers.
But in this further analysis,

452
00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:54,680
these researchers in the 2015
study said they found the fibers

453
00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:57,320
originated from hair follicles,
not fabric.

454
00:23:57,480 --> 00:23:58,520
What?
Right.

455
00:23:58,760 --> 00:23:59,680
No idea.
OK.

456
00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:00,840
It's alien.
Yeah, I think so.

457
00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:02,280
That's probably it.
They're coming.

458
00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:04,520
We didn't go up and get probed
by aliens.

459
00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:08,200
Aliens came down and put hair
fiber or follicle coloring.

460
00:24:09,960 --> 00:24:14,840
Follicle fibrous material that
it might be cotton and also not

461
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:17,520
in US yes that.
Seems logical?

462
00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:20,560
Well, you know the government.
Has acknowledged that they've

463
00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:23,920
that they have aliens so that's
right so this.

464
00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:27,480
Must be I mean, what better way
to topple our world is to put

465
00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:30,960
fibers in a few people in the
Nathan or the world?

466
00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:35,200
Well, anyway, and obviously,
listener, if you don't know us

467
00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:37,360
well enough, you know we're
kidding at this point because we

468
00:24:37,360 --> 00:24:43,480
have no idea.
But in a study in 2018 that

469
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:48,320
involved 1000 people that had
Lyme disease, OK, So they came

470
00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:50,880
out from a different direction.
So thousand people with Lyme

471
00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:54,480
disease.
Of that population, 6% had

472
00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:59,800
Morgellen's disease and tested
positive for the Lyme bacteria.

473
00:24:59,960 --> 00:25:03,720
That's high. 6% is high.
Considering what?

474
00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:05,400
This what?
Yeah, considering the

475
00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:09,040
symptomology and the.
As much as we could tell from

476
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:10,760
etymology, you know, like that's
high.

477
00:25:10,760 --> 00:25:14,200
I would have expected you to say
something like .6%, right?

478
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:17,040
Yeah, I would have too.
But no, it's like, well, it

479
00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:19,400
doesn't that just contradict all
the things we just heard.

480
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:22,560
The other point that's
interesting in this 2018 study

481
00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:26,520
that came from the Lyme disease
direction is that of those with

482
00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:30,680
Morgellons.
So that six percent, 77% of that

483
00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:33,720
group had at least one
additional infection.

484
00:25:34,360 --> 00:25:37,400
So they had Lyme?
7% of the 6%, yeah.

485
00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:39,680
So this.
Group that had the Lyme disease

486
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:45,160
had more Gellin symptoms and 77%
of those had at least another

487
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:48,200
infection and so the same
infection was it 77.

488
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:50,960
Percent had the same other
infection or just another

489
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:54,720
infection, another.
Infection in this case, it makes

490
00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:57,720
me wonder, do you have to have a
certain trifecta together?

491
00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:02,040
I mean and maybe not Triazin 3,
but is in a certain grouping of

492
00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:03,840
things that happen to be
alignment.

493
00:26:03,840 --> 00:26:05,880
To have this happen you have to
create some.

494
00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:11,800
Sort of autoimmune response.
However, with Lyme disease, a

495
00:26:11,800 --> 00:26:15,280
lot of the symptoms that people
get are considered

496
00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:17,600
psychological.
Geez.

497
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:22,560
So now what?
I mean, now what?

498
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:25,520
I have several people I know
that have Lyme disease and

499
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:29,040
before they were actually
successfully diagnosed by the

500
00:26:29,360 --> 00:26:32,880
blood draws that they're able to
do now, they were told that

501
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:34,840
their condition was
psychological.

502
00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:37,320
No, they're not.
They don't have chronic fatigue.

503
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:39,200
They don't have this, they don't
have that.

504
00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:41,720
It's all psychological.
You're just stressed out.

505
00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:46,120
It makes me wonder if ultimately
this Morgellons may fall into

506
00:26:46,120 --> 00:26:49,560
that category that maybe.
OK, gosh, you were right.

507
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:51,720
You are having symptoms that
don't make sense.

508
00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:53,960
And So what would they do?
It does make sense though,

509
00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:55,720
doesn't it, that nobody knows
how to treat them?

510
00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:57,080
Yeah, of course.
I mean.

511
00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:00,680
It's it's a moving target.
It sounds like Yeah 1.

512
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:05,000
Of the first cases of
Mordellians was found in a woman

513
00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:09,840
who was in Korea and this was
the 1970s, so she was 30 years

514
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:13,400
old and female, which a lot of
people argue that many of these

515
00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:16,600
things happen to females.
Now, I don't know if that's

516
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:18,960
really true, if it's really more
common in females or females

517
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:21,000
will say something and males
won't.

518
00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:22,880
I don't know.
That's another whole study.

519
00:27:23,120 --> 00:27:25,720
Sure.
But this particular woman was

520
00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:29,280
similar to the other woman we
had talked about before.

521
00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:33,840
She had had these erosions or
lesions also on her arms, hands

522
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:36,720
and chin, which might go back to
the things we talked about with

523
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:39,920
Doctor Lee, that these are areas
that she could touch herself and

524
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,840
maybe she made them worse.
And she insisted that she had

525
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:45,480
fiber like material under her
skin.

526
00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:49,520
She said she had seen it with a
magnifying glass in the study.

527
00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:54,200
They got a biopsy again, as as
always, because you can't just

528
00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:57,200
look at it go I don't know, so
let's biopsy, let's check it

529
00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:00,280
out.
The people who did biopsy it saw

530
00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:03,960
a fiber excluding from the
dermal side of the specimen, the

531
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:07,680
skin side, the outside, there
was some clamation and things

532
00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:11,400
like that, but they didn't see
any specific microorganism.

533
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:16,400
And she was negative to
basically every other biological

534
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:19,840
infection or, or something like
that that might have called

535
00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:23,320
caused the lesion.
There was no obvious thing that

536
00:28:23,320 --> 00:28:26,040
they thought of testing that was
reacting.

537
00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:28,800
So she didn't have Lyme disease.
She didn't have different

538
00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:30,760
bacteria.
She was checked that way.

539
00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:33,440
And she also had blood draws
that looked for Lyme disease

540
00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:35,960
because that's where it's found
in most cases.

541
00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:37,680
Guess what?
They said they didn't know what

542
00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:43,840
it was in this case.
They did say that a lot of times

543
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:47,680
this Morgellon's disease is
characterized by these fibers

544
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:52,120
appearing in slow or non healing
lesions and even beneath

545
00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:54,800
unbroken skin.
So I could see it like we talked

546
00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:58,440
about before, the skin is broken
so stuff gets in that makes

547
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:00,920
sense.
But in this case, a lot of times

548
00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:04,160
the fibers are underneath skin
is not that is not broken.

549
00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:08,680
And so that seems even stranger.
Yeah, some of the the

550
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:11,640
manifestations like we talked
about that are not related to

551
00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:15,000
the skin are the fatigue, joint
pain, fibromyalgia or sleep

552
00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:18,360
disorders.
And they often tend to coexist,

553
00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:22,280
as we mentioned before, which
then to me makes it like, well,

554
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:24,640
then it definitely is just in
your head.

555
00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:26,880
So what do we do?
I pull out.

556
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:29,280
The fiber, look at it and be
here without this.

557
00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:33,240
I mean, if we can do forensics
on fibers, that would be great.

558
00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:36,080
Wouldn't it be nice if we.
Could do forensic medicine on

559
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:37,840
fibers.
It's like I just can't.

560
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:41,120
I can't buy that it's occurring
naturally.

561
00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:45,800
That's like that's hard for me
to accept because I feel like

562
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:49,240
all of us would have some form
of blue, red, black, white

563
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:53,920
fibers we could identify or
whatever if it was, you know, I

564
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:58,720
don't know, it just so to me,
yeah, it's interesting.

565
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:02,640
I'm a little bit speechless.
Yeah, it is.

566
00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:06,760
I get that because so was I.
I was just like, how could this

567
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:10,680
be?
And, and they're the only

568
00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:14,200
consensus is nobody knows.
Wow.

569
00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:17,200
That's the consensus.
I think though, it's one of the

570
00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:20,400
difficulties in something like
this is that there's a small

571
00:30:20,400 --> 00:30:22,480
percentage of the population
that's affected.

572
00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:25,400
So then where did the dollars go
for research?

573
00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:27,800
They don't go to the 12 people
that's affected.

574
00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,160
They go to the 40,000 people
that's affected.

575
00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:35,840
And fair or not, and, and in a
lot of ways, I mean, you kind of

576
00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:39,200
have to, to do what has the
biggest hit on the biggest

577
00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:41,560
amount of people probably,
especially if there is a

578
00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:43,520
possibility.
But then on the other hand, it

579
00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:46,000
seems to me if there's 12 people
and we can figure it out so the

580
00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:49,240
other 12 people won't have to
suffer, then maybe that's a low

581
00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:53,320
hanging fruit as it were.
But, but I don't know, they just

582
00:30:53,480 --> 00:30:56,440
they've done some more research,
but it looks like the most most

583
00:30:56,640 --> 00:30:59,120
recent study I could find was an
18.

584
00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:02,200
And does that mean that there
are fewer cases?

585
00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:08,120
That's my feeling.
Isn't probably has, although it

586
00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:11,880
does seem to say that in most
cases, whether it's actually

587
00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:15,920
strictly speaking a delusional
or or some sort of hallucination

588
00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:20,280
or something like that, most
people do seem to respond from

589
00:31:20,280 --> 00:31:24,880
some sort of treatments because
if nothing else, they learn how

590
00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:27,680
to deal with it better.
Now, does that mean it goes

591
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:29,560
away?
Nobody's ever said that.

592
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:33,080
Nobody's ever said anyone who
did any kind of psychiatric

593
00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:36,160
treatment, the stuff went away.
But then again, they also said

594
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:39,120
the people who were were told it
was psychiatric and given

595
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:42,360
medications just really didn't
take it because they were just

596
00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:44,200
mad.
And like you said, they felt

597
00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:46,120
betrayed and all of these other
sorts of things.

598
00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:47,880
I'm not going to do it because
that's not true.

599
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:52,600
It's just mind boggling to me
that this can be the case.

600
00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:56,240
So it's just.
So that's my cheerful first

601
00:31:56,240 --> 00:31:57,240
topic.
What do you think?

602
00:31:57,880 --> 00:31:59,080
I think.
It's bizarre.

603
00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:01,360
It's a great topic for the
podcast.

604
00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:05,440
It is and if anyone.
'S heard of this or you even

605
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:07,800
experience it yourself.
We'd love to hear what your

606
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:12,440
experiences have been.
And I can tell you this that I

607
00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:14,960
would feel seriously frustrated
if I was one of these

608
00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:18,680
individuals.
And if that's you, I am so

609
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:20,600
sorry.
I just wish there was something

610
00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:23,880
could come out here in our our
M4 podcast, we'll come up with a

611
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:25,960
solution.
Well, we won't, but we certainly

612
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:27,880
want to support you and you know
if.

613
00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:30,640
It is.
You feel free to let us know any

614
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:33,840
information we missed or
misinterpreted or anything.

615
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:36,360
Anything more you know about it,
anything you'd like to share,

616
00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:38,840
That'd be awesome.
We're totally open to learning

617
00:32:38,840 --> 00:32:39,560
more.
Yeah.

618
00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:41,680
And.
I mean, I'm sure there's some

619
00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:45,560
more little teeny articles
places, but I think what you

620
00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:49,040
said that they just kind of gave
up worrying about it is probably

621
00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:50,360
the most true.
Yeah.

622
00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:53,520
Because if if they couldn't
figure it out and there was no

623
00:32:53,520 --> 00:32:56,920
real clear cut line, so many of
the things that we deal with

624
00:32:57,800 --> 00:33:02,080
common medicine, if it were able
to be pronounced or defined that

625
00:33:02,080 --> 00:33:05,080
way, is you have a broken arm.
You do these things, you have

626
00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:07,040
this.
You do these things when it's

627
00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:10,520
when it's a disorder or problem
that nobody can figure anything

628
00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:13,480
out like, well, we'll just maybe
hope that goes away.

629
00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:17,000
And medicine often is ruling out
the big bad things too.

630
00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:19,560
It's like, OK, so you won't have
a heart attack from this.

631
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:21,200
You won't get that again.
Good luck.

632
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:22,320
Yeah.
The Science.

633
00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:24,680
Of medicine is actually always
ruling things out.

634
00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:26,840
We've just come to a lot of
shortcuts.

635
00:33:27,080 --> 00:33:30,040
Like you said, your example of a
broken arm, we know that with a

636
00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:33,000
broken arm, you want to take an
X-ray, you want to set it in a

637
00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:35,000
certain way.
Depending on how it's broken, it

638
00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:39,160
may need surgery, it may not.
But in reality, like I said,

639
00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:42,400
I'll kind of just repeat myself,
but the science of medicine is

640
00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:45,440
ruling things out.
It's a differential diagnosis.

641
00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:48,200
What is it not?
We've just been, we just learned

642
00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:51,600
to be able to with the common
things like you said, quickly

643
00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:55,000
rule out what it's not because
we have seen this sort of thing

644
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,560
so often, right?
Yeah.

645
00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:01,280
Everything from mechanism of
injury or illness in this case,

646
00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:04,680
to the solutions that have been
developed over hundreds of years

647
00:34:04,760 --> 00:34:07,240
at least.
Anyway, so that was the first

648
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:08,600
thing.
And because that wasn't enough

649
00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:11,639
to fill one episode, I decided
to go with another.

650
00:34:11,679 --> 00:34:15,120
And this is another skin
condition and it is called

651
00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:18,400
chroma hydrosis watery.
Colored watery skin.

652
00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:20,159
Wow, you're super.
Smart.

653
00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:21,880
I didn't know that's what that
sounds like.

654
00:34:21,880 --> 00:34:24,320
I actually didn't even think
about what it could possibly

655
00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:27,520
mean.
So yeah, you're you're very,

656
00:34:27,679 --> 00:34:30,880
very close.
My sources were also from

657
00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:33,320
Medical News today because I
happen to see this when I was

658
00:34:33,320 --> 00:34:37,120
looking at the other stuff.
It's called stat pearls, and

659
00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:40,560
it's from the National Health
Library as well.

660
00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:45,560
The Chrome hydrosis is a rare
condition that causes sweat to

661
00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:48,520
have a color.
So you're very.

662
00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:52,159
Close because water sweat and
this is kind of an interesting

663
00:34:52,159 --> 00:34:58,480
link to me is the sweat color
can be possibly black blue-green

664
00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:01,560
yellow or brown.
Now, some of those colors

665
00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:02,880
overlap.
Yeah.

666
00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:07,640
Are Magellan's colors right?
So do we just naturally produce

667
00:35:07,640 --> 00:35:09,440
those colors?
Maybe I.

668
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:14,400
Mean these two instances make it
more possible than I thought it

669
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:18,440
was before we had this episode.
Exactly.

670
00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:21,440
And when we talk more about
this, you'll find that that's

671
00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:24,720
probably true.
And I had no idea, but this is a

672
00:35:24,720 --> 00:35:26,680
very pleasant way to describe
this.

673
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:29,560
Chromehydrosis is a chronic
condition that causes a person

674
00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:32,440
to have colorful sweat.
Doesn't that sound cheerful?

675
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:34,800
Sounds very cheerful.
Yeah, nobody likes.

676
00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:37,960
It.
There are a few.

677
00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:43,120
Different types of this
condition, there's apricrene and

678
00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:45,880
it affects the areas that have
the apricrene.

679
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:50,920
I hope I'm so pronouncing that
right, but the sweat glands of

680
00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:54,680
this nature are in the torso,
eyelid, scalp, ears, and the

681
00:35:54,840 --> 00:35:59,320
areola, and that's including the
darker skin around the nipple,

682
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:00,840
of course is where the areola
is.

683
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:04,600
And I actually maybe you knew
this, but I didn't know

684
00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:06,760
different sweat glands were in
different places.

685
00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:08,600
I just thought they were all
sweat glands.

686
00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:11,360
Glad they didn't ask you that on
boards anyway.

687
00:36:13,240 --> 00:36:16,760
And then there's sweat glands
that are widely distributed.

688
00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:19,800
They're called the ecrin, and
they can affect sweat in almost

689
00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:22,840
every area of the body.
So if they have them in the

690
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:26,000
ecrin sweat glands, they're more
likely to have this condition

691
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:29,040
all over their body.
And then there's pseudochrome

692
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:33,240
hydrosis, and this is when dyes,
chemicals or pigment producing

693
00:36:33,240 --> 00:36:37,800
bacteria mixed with colorless
sweat to form colored sweat.

694
00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:41,440
So the previous conditions occur
from the body creating these

695
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:43,960
colors.
This one, the pseudo, is where

696
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:46,880
the body has absorbed these
colors potentially from a

697
00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:49,120
bacteria.
And I also wonder if maybe you

698
00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:52,040
know, how many times have you
worn new jeans without washing

699
00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:54,440
them and your legs are are blue.
They're green.

700
00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:57,720
That's weird.
Not green, blue.

701
00:36:58,000 --> 00:36:59,640
Not green unless they're.
Green jeans.

702
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:04,000
But anyway, so yeah, I mean,
that happens, I guess I've

703
00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:07,000
never, one of my kids had that
once.

704
00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:09,880
I don't think I've ever had it,
but I didn't even think of me

705
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:12,280
that they could be absorbing it
into their bodies.

706
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:15,000
It's just on their skin.
Well, their skin is the what?

707
00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:17,720
The biggest gland.
Yeah, the biggest organ of the

708
00:37:17,720 --> 00:37:20,080
whole body.
And so anyway, that's a

709
00:37:20,080 --> 00:37:21,480
pseudochrome.
Hydros.

710
00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:25,120
Now one thing, many of these
disorders happen in a certain

711
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:28,640
range of age.
A lot of times disorders,

712
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:31,040
especially the ones that they
think that might be

713
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:36,000
psychological happen in.
I've noticed like the 20s to 40s

714
00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:38,680
range, right?
And a lot of them don't happen

715
00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:40,120
in younger children.
Partially.

716
00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:43,440
I think that if it is going to
be psychiatric, they haven't

717
00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:46,480
developed some of their beliefs
yet perhaps.

718
00:37:47,240 --> 00:37:51,040
But this Chrome hydrosis can
occur at nearly any age.

719
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:55,240
And the good thing about that is
that when someone who is a small

720
00:37:55,240 --> 00:37:59,240
child that doesn't have a lot of
built in biases or anything like

721
00:37:59,240 --> 00:38:03,560
that might be believed more more
easily, they're not already air

722
00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:05,920
quote damaged maybe to think
these things.

723
00:38:06,240 --> 00:38:09,880
That's probably not the best
word to use, but but that's kind

724
00:38:09,880 --> 00:38:13,040
of what came to mind for me.
They do say that while it can

725
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:16,560
happen in any age, it's most
noticeable after puberty, which

726
00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:19,120
is still also a little younger
than a lot of these other

727
00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:21,320
disorders.
They think that it's because

728
00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:25,800
these glands are secreting more
fluid than they did as a younger

729
00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:27,760
child.
Now, one of the things I did

730
00:38:27,760 --> 00:38:30,880
find out, and I believe we might
cover this a little bit more

731
00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:33,720
later in this part of the
episode, but that as we get

732
00:38:33,720 --> 00:38:36,440
older, our sweat glands are less
efficient.

733
00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:39,280
No, I just read that in the AARP
Magazine.

734
00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:43,320
That's right.
And so it can cause overheating

735
00:38:43,480 --> 00:38:45,920
more quickly because the sweat
glands don't work as well.

736
00:38:46,160 --> 00:38:50,160
So I was thinking if that
happens, if a person does have

737
00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:53,800
the Chrome hydrosis, I wonder if
it would decrease as a person

738
00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:57,400
gets older because the sweat
glands don't work as well.

739
00:38:57,480 --> 00:38:59,280
And that's just hypothesis by
Andrea.

740
00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:02,520
I have no idea.
However there is a whole society

741
00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:06,360
for this so it must be enough
people that are involved that

742
00:39:06,360 --> 00:39:09,840
they have a society, but the
condition is considered scarce

743
00:39:09,840 --> 00:39:12,200
and rare.
There doesn't seem to be any

744
00:39:12,200 --> 00:39:16,760
association between the Chrome
hydrosis and sex, geographic

745
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:20,000
location, season or weather,
though it may be more likely

746
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:22,600
developing people of Africans
descent.

747
00:39:22,720 --> 00:39:25,360
So whether or not people are.
Having sex doesn't impact

748
00:39:25,720 --> 00:39:29,360
whether they have this condition
exactly.

749
00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:33,600
Another brilliant a brilliant
nursing statement by one of our

750
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:39,560
resident nurses.
Oh my.

751
00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:42,880
Goodness, so probably you silly
goose.

752
00:39:44,880 --> 00:39:49,320
So they do notice that the
condition is chronic and the

753
00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:53,720
discoloration of the sweat may
decrease overtime as the body

754
00:39:53,720 --> 00:39:58,200
produces less of the lipo fusion
and and that's a pigment that's

755
00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:00,240
responsible for the color
changes.

756
00:40:00,240 --> 00:40:03,080
So I don't know if it's exactly
the same as what I was just

757
00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:06,360
suggesting with the scent glands
not working as well if that's

758
00:40:06,520 --> 00:40:12,480
along the same lines, but it may
change based on less of the lipo

759
00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:16,000
fu skin.
That is produced and but it's

760
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:18,640
the pigment that causes the
color changes this particular

761
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:21,200
thing.
So then I wonder, well, do we

762
00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:25,000
apparently we all have it and
people with the Chrome hydrosis

763
00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:30,240
may have more of this pigment or
it might be more oxidized.

764
00:40:30,400 --> 00:40:34,800
So one of the theories is that
the, the, the things, the

765
00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:38,360
chemicals, the, the, whatever it
is that causes the coloring

766
00:40:38,480 --> 00:40:41,320
changes may respond to
oxidation.

767
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:43,800
Still one of those things that
they're not totally sure.

768
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:48,360
They do say the condition is
harmless, as in it doesn't have

769
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:51,560
a biological impact.
But I can tell you this that

770
00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:55,120
they definitely seem to have a
lot of psychological impact

771
00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:59,040
because stress or embarrassment
about the coloration can lead to

772
00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:03,520
a lot of difficulties, including
depression and anxiety, and it

773
00:41:03,520 --> 00:41:09,000
can also lead to suicidal
tendencies because people get so

774
00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:10,720
distressed.
Some people have it in just one

775
00:41:10,720 --> 00:41:12,480
small area.
Other people will have it across

776
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:14,600
their bodies.
There were some pictures that I

777
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:16,760
saw that some people had it on
their hands.

778
00:41:16,760 --> 00:41:19,240
Some people, it's not uncommon
to have it on the cheeks for

779
00:41:19,240 --> 00:41:21,480
some reason.
And of course, a lot of people

780
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:24,000
will get in the underarms
because that's a high, high

781
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:27,040
accumulation of sweat glands.
Their shirts will become

782
00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:29,000
discolored.
You've probably seen that where

783
00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:32,320
people have discolored armpits.
I've always thought it was just

784
00:41:32,320 --> 00:41:35,760
because of the Anna person that
they use, but maybe that was

785
00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:39,720
some of the from from hydrosis.
But since it's rare maybe not.

786
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:42,920
I don't know.
This condition is the colored

787
00:41:42,920 --> 00:41:44,800
sweat.
Like I said, the colored and the

788
00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:47,920
vividness of the shade can vary
from person to person.

789
00:41:48,240 --> 00:41:52,160
So say both of us had sweat that
turned black, it could be more

790
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:55,280
significant for you than it is
for me, or vice versa.

791
00:41:55,280 --> 00:41:59,000
Or maybe the other colors are
brighter, darker, whatever.

792
00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:02,480
It can be different.
Even though we both technically

793
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:06,040
have the same disorder as it
were, we already talked about it

794
00:42:06,040 --> 00:42:09,320
being different in different
sorts of glands, but even in the

795
00:42:09,320 --> 00:42:12,960
same gland that causes the same
color, it can be different.

796
00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:16,640
And one of the things, as I
mentioned, that while it is kind

797
00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:20,800
of a benign air quote condition,
it's those feelings of

798
00:42:20,960 --> 00:42:25,200
helplessness, worthlessness,
guilt or anything like that or

799
00:42:25,200 --> 00:42:29,400
anxiety that have affected
people because they have this

800
00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:31,480
disorder.
People can see it.

801
00:42:31,560 --> 00:42:36,560
And I think a lot of times the
disorders that people can see in

802
00:42:36,560 --> 00:42:39,440
some ways can be easier because,
you know, you have a broken arm,

803
00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:41,160
someone says, oh, yeah, you need
treatment for that.

804
00:42:41,200 --> 00:42:44,400
If you have a psychiatric
condition, people can't see it.

805
00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:46,240
But.
And so then they think, well, do

806
00:42:46,240 --> 00:42:47,480
you really need treatment for
that?

807
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:50,000
Well, this is kind of one in an
in between thing.

808
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:52,480
Yeah, I can see it.
Treatment may or may not help,

809
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:54,960
but it's still, it's still kind
of taboo.

810
00:42:54,960 --> 00:42:58,440
It's so weird to me that we put
these things in buckets that

811
00:42:58,440 --> 00:43:02,120
don't often make sense.
So we can come up with a

812
00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:03,520
brilliant solution that would be
grand.

813
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:06,040
So you may be wondering what the
cause of this is.

814
00:43:06,400 --> 00:43:11,760
We already talked about the we
already talked about potentially

815
00:43:12,040 --> 00:43:16,560
having maybe some different
levels of the Lipofusekin.

816
00:43:17,160 --> 00:43:21,920
I really should have looked that
up Patterson because it that one

817
00:43:21,920 --> 00:43:25,960
in the Apricon gland.
This enzyme will become

818
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:28,640
discolored naturally with
creating sweat.

819
00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:30,960
But for some reason, the people
with their Chrome hydrogen

820
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:36,040
create potentially as we said
more of it or darker or whatever

821
00:43:36,040 --> 00:43:38,400
it is that that is happening
already.

822
00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:42,320
But they don't really understand
the other reasons for the

823
00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:45,840
discoloration in many cases.
Sometimes they think it might be

824
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:49,080
just friction against the skin
that causes discoloration.

825
00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:51,600
I mean, could that could it be
heat related?

826
00:43:51,840 --> 00:43:55,000
Because they also think that hot
showers or baths can increase

827
00:43:55,000 --> 00:43:56,920
it.
I believe in these cases, the

828
00:43:56,920 --> 00:44:00,200
person already has to have the
Chrome, Chrome hydrosis.

829
00:44:00,440 --> 00:44:03,240
It's not like you and I would
suddenly start having different

830
00:44:03,240 --> 00:44:05,360
colors because we took a hot
shower.

831
00:44:05,560 --> 00:44:09,000
But I think that what they're
saying is that these might make

832
00:44:09,000 --> 00:44:12,160
the glands, make the
discoloration more likely.

833
00:44:12,160 --> 00:44:15,680
So maybe they need to wear
looser clothing or take cooler

834
00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:19,240
baths or showers and maybe not
go into a hot tub or something

835
00:44:19,240 --> 00:44:21,280
like that.
They also indicate that

836
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:25,880
sometimes sexual arousal or pain
or anxiety can cause an increase

837
00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:27,200
in this.
Oh, interesting.

838
00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:30,080
So those were not.
The one particular would be not

839
00:44:30,080 --> 00:44:32,360
one I'd want to have colors
coming out of my body.

840
00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:37,120
I don't know.
And I'm sure I'm sure this

841
00:44:37,120 --> 00:44:40,080
information comes from people
report self reporting their

842
00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:42,240
their symptoms.
But so I don't know at what

843
00:44:42,240 --> 00:44:46,320
level that this is a common
thing or or how it works.

844
00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:49,480
And again, being another rare
condition, there's not a lot of

845
00:44:49,480 --> 00:44:51,240
study about it.
It's just basically self

846
00:44:51,240 --> 00:44:53,240
reporting.
It sounds like some of them, as

847
00:44:53,240 --> 00:44:58,320
we mentioned will be triggered
or exacerbated with someone

848
00:44:58,320 --> 00:45:03,400
ingesting water soluble dyes,
heavy metals such as copper and,

849
00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:07,480
and they say ingest copper.
Now in most cases people are

850
00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:09,440
wearing copper and they get that
green.

851
00:45:09,720 --> 00:45:13,000
So that made me of course
wonder, do these people respond

852
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:16,080
even more significantly to the
copper oxidization?

853
00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:19,720
Because all of us, well, I think
almost everyone does.

854
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:22,960
Copper can change skin tone to
green.

855
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:24,880
Does that mean it happens more
or not?

856
00:45:24,880 --> 00:45:27,360
I don't know.
And then some food slate

857
00:45:27,360 --> 00:45:32,360
flavourings or colourings or
some some medications such as

858
00:45:32,400 --> 00:45:36,280
Pepto Bismol.
And it somehow has a yellow dye,

859
00:45:36,280 --> 00:45:38,800
which is interesting to me
because I see it as pink.

860
00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:42,600
But maybe it's part of the
coloring process, which is I

861
00:45:42,600 --> 00:45:46,160
think one of the reasons why so
many countries have banned dyes

862
00:45:46,160 --> 00:45:47,960
because things like this happen.
That's.

863
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:56,560
And the one with the
pseudochrome hydrosis is as we

864
00:45:56,560 --> 00:45:59,080
mentioned, coming from an
external source.

865
00:45:59,080 --> 00:46:01,840
So there's the chemicals, the
dyes like we just talked about

866
00:46:02,120 --> 00:46:05,000
now we talked about it might
exacerbate or worsen this

867
00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:07,040
condition and people who
actually have it, but it can

868
00:46:07,040 --> 00:46:11,080
also mimic it as it were by
people who don't have it, but

869
00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:13,600
still have are maybe highly
sensitive to color.

870
00:46:13,840 --> 00:46:17,640
That makes me wonder if perhaps
people are metabolizing these

871
00:46:17,640 --> 00:46:20,520
things more quickly before they
can get fully broken down.

872
00:46:20,520 --> 00:46:24,400
Make maybe the most most of us
do so, so more color will come

873
00:46:24,400 --> 00:46:25,800
through because it goes so
quickly.

874
00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:27,600
It couldn't be breaking broken
down.

875
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:32,320
That's another theory by Andrea.
Yeah.

876
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:35,400
And there's other health
concerns or issues that can

877
00:46:35,400 --> 00:46:38,200
cause sweat to change color.
Infection is one of them.

878
00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:40,640
Blood in the sweat.
Have you ever heard of that?

879
00:46:41,680 --> 00:46:43,280
That sounds like a very.
Bad idea.

880
00:46:43,440 --> 00:46:46,560
And of course extra bilirubin.
So if a person is in liver

881
00:46:46,560 --> 00:46:50,640
failure or liver damage, that
can cause changes and some

882
00:46:50,640 --> 00:46:53,800
poisonings can cause changes.
Now this.

883
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:57,160
This quote made me laugh.
It's a good idea to see a doctor

884
00:46:57,160 --> 00:47:02,160
about colored sweats, OK?
I think so, yeah.

885
00:47:02,720 --> 00:47:06,840
I mean, I just, I just have to
say if I have something colored

886
00:47:06,840 --> 00:47:09,000
that a way that it's not
supposed to be colored coming

887
00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:11,000
out of my body, you're going to
hear about it.

888
00:47:11,520 --> 00:47:13,520
It's not going to be something
I'm going to keep to myself.

889
00:47:14,960 --> 00:47:17,920
But as we talked about, if you
do have something like this

890
00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:21,720
going on, you do want to talk to
a medical provider because they

891
00:47:21,720 --> 00:47:24,920
can, as we talked about before,
rule out more serious causes of

892
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:27,800
a particular issue or problem.
I mean, say it is yellow and

893
00:47:27,800 --> 00:47:30,480
your, your liver's having
issues, you'll want to know.

894
00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:33,360
And so it can be treated because
it's certainly get to a point

895
00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:35,960
that it's too late.
So, but I just thought that

896
00:47:35,960 --> 00:47:39,320
quote, it's a good idea to see a
doctor about colored sweat.

897
00:47:39,520 --> 00:47:41,840
If yes, yes it is happening to
you.

898
00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:47,520
You might be a doctor.
Please do Oh my goodness.

899
00:47:47,840 --> 00:47:51,360
So the treatment as many things
that to reduce the amount of

900
00:47:51,360 --> 00:47:55,240
sweat or the things that are
causing the colored sweat to

901
00:47:55,240 --> 00:47:57,760
happen.
So of course I mean just reduce

902
00:47:57,760 --> 00:47:59,800
what's making it happen and that
can help.

903
00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:02,480
Well then.
I struggle with that because

904
00:48:02,480 --> 00:48:04,960
that means don't exercise right?
Like that.

905
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:08,200
I don't know or.
Or it means exercise in a cooler

906
00:48:08,200 --> 00:48:11,640
room, don't do hot yoga, go
hiking, but in the fountains

907
00:48:11,640 --> 00:48:13,920
where it's cooler versus in
Death Valley.

908
00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:17,440
So which?
Sounds like a generally good

909
00:48:17,600 --> 00:48:20,080
plan anyway.
So there are some things.

910
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:23,760
And also there's there say
Pilates, you can adjust it to

911
00:48:23,800 --> 00:48:27,200
the level that works best for
you that maybe is below that

912
00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:29,120
really heavy sweating threshold.
Yeah.

913
00:48:29,400 --> 00:48:31,400
Since it is a benign.
Condition.

914
00:48:31,520 --> 00:48:34,240
Maybe wear the shirt the color
of the sweat and just not worry

915
00:48:34,240 --> 00:48:35,400
about it that day?
Sure.

916
00:48:35,400 --> 00:48:37,280
I don't know.
I can say that I don't know if

917
00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:41,920
it'd be easier, as easy to do as
you know me saying it, but one

918
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:45,720
of the things they found that if
a person has enough liquid to

919
00:48:45,840 --> 00:48:49,080
the more dehydrated they are,
the darker the sweat is or the

920
00:48:49,080 --> 00:48:52,360
darker the more colored it is.
And that makes sense.

921
00:48:52,520 --> 00:48:56,440
They also talk about applying A
capsaicin cream once or twice a

922
00:48:56,440 --> 00:49:01,560
day and that can tighten those
pores maybe to keep some of that

923
00:49:01,560 --> 00:49:03,320
sweat in.
But then I worry about, well,

924
00:49:03,320 --> 00:49:06,640
what's happening next?
And so that's probably.

925
00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:10,200
One of those things that they do
before something special maybe

926
00:49:10,200 --> 00:49:12,200
maybe they're going to give A
and they don't want to have

927
00:49:12,320 --> 00:49:16,000
purple rings under their arms.
But they said just as a warning

928
00:49:16,000 --> 00:49:17,720
this can cause a burning
sensation.

929
00:49:18,040 --> 00:49:20,840
Oh imagine.
Yeah, Aaron, don't get anywhere

930
00:49:20,840 --> 00:49:24,840
near your eyeballs and.
Those who don't know, capsaicin

931
00:49:24,840 --> 00:49:28,600
is what makes hot Peppers hot
and cayenne hot and.

932
00:49:29,560 --> 00:49:31,760
Yeah, good point.
This is hot.

933
00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:34,560
That's a really.
Good point to mention what that

934
00:49:34,560 --> 00:49:36,520
is.
So definitely something to keep

935
00:49:36,520 --> 00:49:41,360
away from eyes and other tender
tissues for some reason in the

936
00:49:41,520 --> 00:49:44,880
the application of the topical
aluminum chloride, which would

937
00:49:44,880 --> 00:49:47,360
be probably found in those
deodorants that now we're not

938
00:49:47,360 --> 00:49:50,280
supposed to use because aluminum
can cause Alzheimer's.

939
00:49:50,280 --> 00:49:53,040
So maybe I won't sweat.
These feel like temporary

940
00:49:53,040 --> 00:49:55,480
treatments.
Maybe in an in an incident that

941
00:49:55,480 --> 00:49:58,640
you want to keep things lower
rather than as long term because

942
00:49:58,640 --> 00:50:00,800
we already know some of these
things can be a problem.

943
00:50:00,800 --> 00:50:04,280
Also receiving Botox injections
to the potentially hyperactive

944
00:50:04,280 --> 00:50:07,840
scent glands or excuse me, sweat
glands because that can keep

945
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:10,000
them from producing as much
again.

946
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:11,680
I still wonder, OK, that's
that's fine.

947
00:50:12,000 --> 00:50:15,840
But if I'm doing that and my
body's whole temperature control

948
00:50:15,840 --> 00:50:20,280
mechanism is around sweat and
I'm stopping it, well, what

949
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:22,720
other things do I need to do?
I probably need to protect

950
00:50:22,720 --> 00:50:25,400
myself from extra heat and
whatever that looks like.

951
00:50:25,400 --> 00:50:29,120
Back to the whole hiking in the
mountains versus doing hot yoga

952
00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:30,120
sort of thing.
Yeah.

953
00:50:30,120 --> 00:50:34,840
And then they also say if it is
the pseudochrome hydrosis, then

954
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:38,880
stay reduce contact with dye,
chemicals or heavy metals that

955
00:50:39,160 --> 00:50:42,240
do the discoloration, which
probably is generally a good

956
00:50:42,240 --> 00:50:45,720
principle for people anyway to
stay away from those sorts of

957
00:50:45,720 --> 00:50:48,000
things.
They have done some research

958
00:50:48,000 --> 00:50:51,280
about whether this has any
microbial issues.

959
00:50:51,280 --> 00:50:53,960
Like they did say that at some
point they think that some

960
00:50:53,960 --> 00:50:56,720
bacteria might be causing it,
but they're not really sure.

961
00:50:56,800 --> 00:51:01,280
So they may try an antimicrobial
to see if it changes anything.

962
00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:05,680
In most cases it does not seem
to make a difference, but there

963
00:51:05,680 --> 00:51:10,360
is some thought that bringing if
a person's skin or medication is

964
00:51:10,560 --> 00:51:14,640
causing these changes in
microbes, maybe that can help if

965
00:51:14,640 --> 00:51:18,280
their level of the microbe or
bacteria is rebalanced.

966
00:51:18,400 --> 00:51:22,360
But I guess if it doesn't help,
then that's not the type of

967
00:51:22,360 --> 00:51:25,880
chromohydrosis they have.
Basically the idea is you go to

968
00:51:25,880 --> 00:51:28,680
your doctor if you have it, they
can perform a physical exam,

969
00:51:28,680 --> 00:51:31,520
make sure there's nothing else
going on at that point.

970
00:51:31,600 --> 00:51:34,640
If the person is getting a lot
of distress or concern about it,

971
00:51:34,640 --> 00:51:37,800
after they realize it's nothing
significantly impacting their

972
00:51:37,800 --> 00:51:40,200
health, then they can deal with
some of the other symptoms.

973
00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:43,200
And they can also talk with a
someone to help them deal with

974
00:51:43,200 --> 00:51:46,760
the results of the different
color stretch sweat, which would

975
00:51:46,760 --> 00:51:50,360
probably be some sort of
therapist, say, OK, what kind of

976
00:51:50,360 --> 00:51:52,800
coping strategies can I build
that kind of thing.

977
00:51:53,040 --> 00:51:57,560
And it is rare, but I think that
if I'm one of the people, the

978
00:51:57,560 --> 00:52:01,160
rare thing, I'd still want to
know what I could do about it.

979
00:52:01,440 --> 00:52:04,800
And also a lot of times just
knowing we're not the only one

980
00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:08,200
really helps a lot.
So that's what I have two very

981
00:52:08,320 --> 00:52:12,960
two very colorful skin
conditions and very unusual

982
00:52:13,160 --> 00:52:17,280
things that most of us are
probably glad it's unusual

983
00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:20,040
because of course, if it was
more common, maybe people

984
00:52:20,040 --> 00:52:21,960
wouldn't worry about it.
It wouldn't matter.

985
00:52:21,960 --> 00:52:24,280
Yeah, no kidding.
Yeah, if our.

986
00:52:24,280 --> 00:52:26,560
Listeners have anything they
want to contribute on this as

987
00:52:26,560 --> 00:52:28,880
well, or if they've seen someone
or noticed it in themselves,

988
00:52:28,920 --> 00:52:30,760
just let us know.
All right, Thanks.

989
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:32,360
Y'all talk to you?
Again, all right.

990
00:52:32,360 --> 00:52:35,280
If you've made it this far,
clearly you like a little mayhem

991
00:52:35,280 --> 00:52:37,600
with your medicine or you just
enjoy hearing.

992
00:52:37,600 --> 00:52:39,520
Us ramble about weird medical
mysteries.

993
00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:42,720
Either way, we'd love you for
it, so hit that follow.

994
00:52:42,720 --> 00:52:45,520
Or subscribe button wherever
you're listening and toss us a

995
00:52:45,520 --> 00:52:47,560
rating or.
Review while you're at it helps

996
00:52:47,600 --> 00:52:51,160
other curious weirdos find the
show, and we know.

997
00:52:51,160 --> 00:52:52,560
There are a lot of you out
there.

998
00:52:52,880 --> 00:52:55,400
Oh, so many.
Come join the chaos.

999
00:52:55,440 --> 00:52:58,600
Thanks for listening to.
Medicine, mystery, mayhem and

1000
00:52:58,600 --> 00:53:01,160
sometimes murder.
Do you have an idea for?

1001
00:53:01,160 --> 00:53:04,160
An episode of this podcast.
Just want to say hi.

1002
00:53:04,520 --> 00:53:07,520
You can get in touch with us at
our M4 pod.

1003
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:17,200
That's OURM the #4pod@gmail.com.
We read every e-mail and

1004
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:20,560
sometimes we even respond just
like real professionals.

1005
00:53:20,720 --> 00:53:22,920
Because we are.
Old friends.

1006
00:53:23,080 --> 00:53:26,680
With new twists and lots of body
bags.