Here I Go Down That Wrong Road Again

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Welcome to M4 Medicine, mystery,
mayhem, and sometimes murder.

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I'm Andrea Marciano and RN with
35 years of experience across

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various fields.
From direct patient care in

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hospitals to home health,
geriatrics, and injury medicine,

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I face life, death, and
everything in between.

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And I'm Crystal Miller and RN
with 13 1/2 years of experience.

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My work spans home health,
Hospice, emergency care,

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geriatrics, and occupational
health.

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From the chaos of trauma based
quiet moments with patients,

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I've seen stories that defy
explanations.

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We've been friends for over 25
years and as nurses we've shared

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countless stories that have left
us and our families speechless.

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Now we're bringing those stories
and many more to you in

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medicine, mystery, mayhem, and
sometimes murder.

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Each week, we'll uncover cases
that challenge the boundaries of

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medicine, sharing the human
stories behind the science.

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From puzzling medical mysteries
to shocking real life crimes,

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we'll bring you stories that'll
leave you questioning everything

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you thought you knew.
While we're both experienced

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nurses, we want to make make it
clear we're not here to give

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medical advice.
This podcast is about

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storytelling, education and
exploration, not diagnosing or

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treating medical conditions.
This is medicine, mystery,

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mayhem and sometimes murder.
Let's dive in.

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Hey Crystal, how are you doing?
I'm doing well.

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How are you?
I am well, thank you, enjoying

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just everything and having my
family visiting and that kind of

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thing.
So it's all good.

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It's.
Nice.

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Yeah, I am.
I have a funny story.

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I've been having these dreams,
repeated dreams, night after

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night after night and I don't
understand it.

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And in it, I'm in college and
I'm a semester away from

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graduating.
I'm in that semester and I've

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like skipped every single class.
You like a purpose.

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Yeah, yeah, it's funny too,
because my third period class,

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whatever.
So I have three classes a day

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apparently, and I always go to
the first one.

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I always skip the second and
third one.

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And my third period class is
taught by Jimmy Fallon.

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And I'm like, I don't know if
he's still teaching it, you

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know, because like, he was not
famous now he's famous anyway.

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But it's every single dream is
about whether or not I'm going

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to graduate like.
Oh my gosh, how am I going?

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To graduate, I know, am I going
to graduate?

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How am I going to graduate
another one?

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I was, I was missing school
because I had to drive a school

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bus for troubled youth, if you
will, from school to get them

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from school to home.
And of course they were punks on

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the on the bus and there was all
these things.

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So I missed my class.
And anyway, it's always this

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strange thing of I really want
to graduate and I really don't

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think I'm going to.
I graduated from college like,

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well, first of all, I graduated
first time in 2009 and the

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second time in 2019.
Like I've graduated from college

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y'all.
And you didn't know what this

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dream is about?
That's hilarious, I said.

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That's hilarious.
It seems like there must be

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something that you need to
complete that you haven't

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completed recently there.
Must be I just, it's so strange.

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It's and it's so stressful,
right?

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Like I just want to graduate
from college.

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I'm so close.
I just want to graduate from

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college.
Oh, it's so weird.

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Yeah, I just wish you would.
I wonder if there's something

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that you have, Is there
something you have that's

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hanging over your head, like
work project or something?

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No, I do have AI have to fight
my electric company to pay a

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$7000 plumbing bill for a pipe
that they drilled through when

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they were burying table.
Oh, so it might be that.

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Yeah, it could be.
I know that's not one of your

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favorite things.
No, it's not.

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That's definitely like hanging
over my head.

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Like I don't want to do it well,
but it's huge, right?

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Like I got a big.
Yeah, that's a big deal.

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My whole line and.
Yeah.

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And the water company doesn't go
after the electric company for

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that.
No, because it's my line.

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Oh, oh, I see.
Gotcha.

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I have to go after the electric
company for.

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Me.
Yeah, maybe that's what you get

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to graduate from.
Maybe.

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Oh gosh.
Oh, adulting can be hard.

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Or can.
Yeah, well, Speaking of which,

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what do you have for us today?
OK, so this is a story that I

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have.
OK, so when I was young, about

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12 years old I would guess, I
read my first, It was True Crime

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book, and it was a cliche.
It was The Stranger Beside Me by

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annual.
And the reason I chose that one

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at the time was because my aunt
Annetta, her roommate, had a

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brush with Ted Bundy.
I don't remember the details.

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I can make up details that I
think I remember, but I'm not

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going to like.
OK, I'll tell you what I think I

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remember.
It might not be accurate.

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I believe my Aunt Annetta's
roommate went on a date with Ted

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Bundy.
I think that's what it was.

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But definitely my mom had told
me a story of how Annetta had,

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you know, was 6° of separation
and from Ted Bundy in some way.

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So that was the first book I
read because because of that,

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you know, familial connection.
The second book I read was was a

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book called Sorry, I have to
scroll.

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Unfortunately I don't remember
the name off the top of my head

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because I'm old.
There you go.

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Every breath you take is what it
was called.

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Actually, I did just remember
that off the top of my head

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because I wasn't finding it in
my notes.

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Every breath to take.
And that is, of course, one of

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the sources for today's story.
Today is going to be one of our

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murder stories.
That's funny because mine for

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our next recording is Murder
Story.

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Now you said.
Sometimes murder.

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I'm just saying.
That's right.

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I think I've mentioned on this
podcast that I have more than I

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mean, I have an immediate
connection with a very famous

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killer, James D'Angelo, the
Golden State Killer.

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I don't know if you've mentioned
it.

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Excuse me, When he was in the
east area, in the Carmichael

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area in California, he was
called the East Area Rapist

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because it was before he started
killing.

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He had broken, attempted to
break into my window when I was

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10.
They had his footprints.

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They knew.
Yeah, they knew they were his

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footprints.
They just didn't know who he was

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yet.
When people ask me why so

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hysterical about closing,
locking windows and everything

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else, it's that that sort of
thing does not go away very

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easily.
And especially knowing I think

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it was the victim He had at the
time, just after he had tried to

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break in my window, the one
around the corner that he had

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gotten who was had the window
open that he, he usually set it

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up, he opened windows in advance
and then he come back.

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Well, she he attempted to kill
her.

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Yikes.
That was the next victim he had

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just not killed yet.
But it's not 'cause he didn't

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want to.
Yeah, you.

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Had another connection to
murderers, you know.

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Your brother was the.
Investigator Yeah of the impact

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training killers, two brothers
that robbed an old couple and

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blamed it on IMPACT, which is
large group awareness training

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in Salt Lake City, UT.
And the West and the Mormon

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church, correct?
Yeah, they actually blamed it

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more on that than the training
group.

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But yeah, it was the whole thing
where they tried to blame

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everybody but themselves.
Yep.

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So that yeah, your brother
investors that and he's in the

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book quoted.
I remember that.

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I was like Fred, Fred Marciano.
Wait, what?

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Yeah, yeah.
Well, and also my stepdad was

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captain the Marine County
Sheriff's Department when they

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caught the Mount Tama Pious
Killer.

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He was an integral part of that
investigation.

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And I believe it was the 80s.
We have a lot of fun history.

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Yeah, no.
Kidding.

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And we're all alive to talk
about it, which I'm happy to

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say.
Yeah, all.

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Right, so my.
Sources are of course every

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breath you take by Anne Rule.
This is called court files show

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couple was troubled in the Tampa
Bay Times a lot of Tampa Bay

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Times by the way, actually I'm
just going to say these next

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four are also from the Tampa Bay
Times.

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So slang saga twist turns 2 life
sentences, daughter's hatred,

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Belushi's former husband
indicted and the evidence that

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Allen Blackthorne and then
lastly Blackthorne stands trial

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from CBS News.
Have you ever heard of this?

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Of the murder of Sheila Belush?
I believe I have, but I don't

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recall details.
OK, so, so I know there's a lot

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of controversy over saying this,
but if I were to say, quote UN

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quote, what my favorite murderer
was, this would be my favorite

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murder.
And of course I want to caveat

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that with I don't I don't murder
when I say my favorite murder,

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It's the one that has stuck with
me the most.

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It's the most intriguing to me.
It's breaks my heart the most,

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but it's definitely it's the
most important murder in my in

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my knowledge base, I guess.
How's that?

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Yeah, and there's a lot of
people that talk about these in

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a lot of different ways.
There's lighters, as Enroll was,

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and there's a bazillion podcast,
some of which we have listened

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to, some of which we haven't.
We're always looking for more.

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And that's one of the reasons we
didn't want to be just a murder

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podcast because there are so
many people are covering that.

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We wanted to explore all the
things we're interested in, but

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I think everyone who follows
murder or is interested in

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murder sort of stories has,
they're the one that made the

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biggest impact.
It's true and.

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This was long before I was
another and that will be

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relevant when I get into the
story.

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This is long before I was a
mother.

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I mean, I, like I said, I was
12/12/13, fourteen years old,

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very young, not thinking about
my future at all.

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Just thinking about, you know,
if my best friend was going to

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be able to come over and hang
out.

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That was the most.
Important thing to me, those

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important things, that's right.
Do I get do I get paid for

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babysitting my siblings or do I
have to?

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Right.
I want to bring you into a life

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tragically short, a woman who
left one painful life, rebuilt

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another, and still couldn't
escape the reach of her past.

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This is the story of Sheila
Belush, her childhood, her

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marriages, her strength and the
horror that followed.

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Yeah, Let me just interject for
a minute.

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It just seems like there are
some people that never seem to

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get ahead, right.
I mean, they, like you said,

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start with a tragic life, make
decisions.

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And some people can say, and you
know, both of us have made some

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relationship decisions that
weren't totally brilliant.

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But it seems like when you don't
get that first good example, it

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can be so challenging to to move
forward in a positive way.

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And fortunately, even though
we've made poor choices, we've

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had good examples that we were
then able to move on from.

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But some of you people just
don't have that kind of support.

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Yep.
It's true.

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Carry on.
Probably.

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I imagine this is involved.
So Sheila Lee Walsh was born

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October 19th, 1962 in Topeka,
KS.

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She was raised by a single
mother after her father died in

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the Vietnam War in 1972.
Which fun fact, my dad

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volunteered for the draft during
the Vietnam War because he was

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reckless teenage, well young
adult punk and they stationed

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him in Germany.
My dad spent the Vietnam War in

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Germany.
Isn't that hilarious?

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Well, and my dad was not
volunteer, but he was drafted

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and was kept stateside because
he had new infants, myself and

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my sister.
And he was a drill Sergeant in

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training and I believe it's
Alameda.

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And if you can imagine, my dad
is a drill Sergeant.

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He hated every moment of it and
he was grateful he was stateside

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and was able to still support
the family because he, I believe

228
00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:02,080
he came home after his basic
training.

229
00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:04,880
I believe he came home every day
that he went to do his drill

230
00:11:04,880 --> 00:11:08,160
Sergeant actions and then came
home because they felt it was

231
00:11:08,160 --> 00:11:11,920
going to be a hardship on my
mother to have two newborn twins

232
00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:14,760
to take care of by herself.
My father was a few years ahead

233
00:11:14,760 --> 00:11:17,280
of your father as far as that.
Also, my father's a few years

234
00:11:17,280 --> 00:11:19,120
older than your father.
Interesting fun.

235
00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:23,360
Factor Anyway so so his her
father had died in the war is

236
00:11:23,360 --> 00:11:24,360
that that's.
What we got.

237
00:11:24,360 --> 00:11:26,080
So she was 10 years old when her
father died.

238
00:11:26,880 --> 00:11:30,200
So Sheila moved with her to
Salem, OR, where she graduated

239
00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:33,400
from Spring High School in 1980.
She was an honor student and on

240
00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:37,320
the track team, just obviously a
determined, spirited young lady.

241
00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:41,200
So it was around 1982 when
Sheila met Alan Blackthorn, then

242
00:11:41,200 --> 00:11:44,280
Van Hout, a medical equipment
entrepreneur from San Antonio.

243
00:11:44,280 --> 00:11:46,560
They married quickly, and within
a year or two, they had two

244
00:11:46,560 --> 00:11:49,120
daughters, Stevie and Daryl.
At first, everything looked

245
00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:50,960
fine.
Alan drove luxury cars, had

246
00:11:50,960 --> 00:11:52,640
business success.
They were wealthy.

247
00:11:52,720 --> 00:11:55,520
They bought a big house.
You know, they were living the

248
00:11:55,640 --> 00:11:58,320
American dream, if you will.
But it wasn't very long before

249
00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:00,760
cracks started appearing.
Sheila became increasingly

250
00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:04,800
isolated, depressed, and there
were signs to her friends and

251
00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:06,920
acquaintances that she was quite
afraid.

252
00:12:07,120 --> 00:12:10,680
A court psychologist later noted
her postpartum depression and

253
00:12:10,680 --> 00:12:14,440
fear of her husband Alan had
begun to control her with

254
00:12:14,440 --> 00:12:17,520
accusations, threats, pressure,
that he controlled everything

255
00:12:17,520 --> 00:12:20,600
she did, where she went, what
she wore, what she drove, who

256
00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:22,720
she spoke to.
I mean, just literally

257
00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:26,840
everything.
By 1987, he was arrested for

258
00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:29,920
assault and he pled guilty to to
assaulting her.

259
00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:31,320
Oh.
So the assault was arrested for

260
00:12:31,320 --> 00:12:33,680
her so domestic violence.
Yeah, yeah.

261
00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:35,440
Yep, Yep.
Exactly.

262
00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:38,920
He he assaulted her and he was
arrested and pled guilty.

263
00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:42,080
They divorced and their divorce
was finalized in 1989.

264
00:12:42,080 --> 00:12:46,360
But because Alan's a giant butt
hole, the legal, the legal part

265
00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:49,800
of it went on and on and on, and
it was just absolute emotional

266
00:12:49,800 --> 00:12:51,800
warfare.
Sheila was able to get primary

267
00:12:51,800 --> 00:12:54,000
custody.
Alan refused to pay child

268
00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:56,280
support.
He fought with her aggressively

269
00:12:56,280 --> 00:12:58,000
and publicly threatened her
life.

270
00:12:58,280 --> 00:13:01,080
Wow yeah he was a real winner.
He was so the Co worker.

271
00:13:01,080 --> 00:13:04,000
He had contacts to have her
taken to Mexico and she would

272
00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:06,320
never return to Stevie his
daughter.

273
00:13:06,320 --> 00:13:08,320
He had said I hate her and I
want her dead.

274
00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:10,840
Oh my gosh.
And so Stevie would have been

275
00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:13,840
like 11 or so by then.
So Stevie would have been about

276
00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:16,800
actually about 5.
Wait, was Stevie the oldest?

277
00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:23,680
Yeah, so Stevie was born in 83
or 84 and this was 89 so OK, 5.

278
00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:27,200
So he's telling a 5 year old I
hate her and I want her dead.

279
00:13:27,680 --> 00:13:32,160
That's rad dude.
You're you're a treat, so.

280
00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:35,440
Oh, work a Piece of work A.
Piece of work indeed.

281
00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:37,520
In the divorce.
A jury ruled, of course, that

282
00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:40,880
Sheila had custody of the girls.
She was awarded $75,000 in

283
00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:43,040
damages and 20% of Alan's
company.

284
00:13:43,160 --> 00:13:45,440
The years after the doors were
fraught.

285
00:13:45,520 --> 00:13:48,520
Like I said, Alan fought for
custody, borrowed heavily and

286
00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:50,360
reduced child support.
Oh, just cutting his child

287
00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:53,320
support and he was paying from
12150 to 350.

288
00:13:53,320 --> 00:13:54,960
He did it randomly.
That was his choice.

289
00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:56,000
Yeah.
He just.

290
00:13:56,120 --> 00:13:58,600
He just decided, Oh no, it looks
looks like it was done in court.

291
00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:02,080
But then his child support went
back up to 1100 after a bunch of

292
00:14:02,080 --> 00:14:05,960
appeals that he lost.
He also delayed or withheld

293
00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:08,160
payments from his medical
company paycheck.

294
00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:11,760
So where she had 20% of the of
the company, he would just not

295
00:14:12,120 --> 00:14:13,960
give her the money.
He would just withhold it.

296
00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:17,880
Like I said, he threatened
Sheila openly telling associates

297
00:14:17,880 --> 00:14:20,120
he could send her to Mexico and
she'd never be seen again.

298
00:14:20,120 --> 00:14:22,560
He hired private investigators
to follow her.

299
00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:25,600
She even after she secured full
custody of her daughters and

300
00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:28,080
changed their last names to
Blue, she wouldn't let he

301
00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:31,240
wouldn't let go.
So why did he?

302
00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:34,080
Why did she change their last
name to Belush, you ask?

303
00:14:34,200 --> 00:14:37,920
I do ask.
In 1993, Sheila met and married

304
00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:41,960
Jamie Belush OH, a man who
offered stability. 2 years

305
00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:45,360
later, in 1995, they welcomed
quadruplets.

306
00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:47,240
Bringing their.
Family to 6.

307
00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:50,520
Oh, by golly, that's a lot.
Yeah, that's a lot.

308
00:14:50,560 --> 00:14:52,160
Back then, that was natural,
too.

309
00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:53,400
Uh huh.
Exactly.

310
00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:57,240
Man, I had twins and I can't
imagine 4.

311
00:14:58,400 --> 00:15:00,800
It makes me think of the
Octomom, you know, with eight.

312
00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:05,160
And.
Oh man, I cannot even imagine.

313
00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:07,760
They're old now, by the way.
They're all like teenagers I

314
00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:09,560
know or something.
It's wild.

315
00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:12,160
So these quads were born in 95.
Yes.

316
00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:17,720
So in September of 1997, they
moved from San Antonio to to

317
00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:21,640
Sarasota, FL, which was nearly
1200 miles, which will become

318
00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:23,880
relevant.
Sheila began attending church,

319
00:15:23,880 --> 00:15:26,960
making friends, feeling a sense
of peace that she really hadn't

320
00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:29,160
known for years, or ever,
really.

321
00:15:29,200 --> 00:15:30,560
Yeah.
Yeah, exactly.

322
00:15:30,680 --> 00:15:31,800
Now, what was your husband's
name?

323
00:15:31,800 --> 00:15:33,800
I forgot.
Jamie Belousch.

324
00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:35,920
Jamie And didn't you say what he
did?

325
00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:38,440
I don't.
Think it does actually.

326
00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:40,160
I just wondered how that was
going.

327
00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:41,680
Or, but irrelevant.
Go ahead.

328
00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:42,720
Yeah, I don't know.
Sorry.

329
00:15:43,680 --> 00:15:45,480
No worries.
So Sheila told her mother just

330
00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:47,840
before the move.
Mommy, I feel God, she was

331
00:15:47,840 --> 00:15:49,240
watching over us.
I feel safe.

332
00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:52,640
She believed this was a new
chapter and she let kind of left

333
00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:59,680
behind any fear.
Would we be talking murder if

334
00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:01,560
there was no reason?
Exactly.

335
00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:03,440
But Alan, of course, wouldn't
let it rest.

336
00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:05,880
He pressured acquaintances for
her new address, hired private

337
00:16:05,880 --> 00:16:10,480
investigators who followed her
from church to home in Yeah, in

338
00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:13,320
July 1997.
So this is 2 years after the

339
00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:16,440
quadruplets were born.
During a golf trip, Alan asked

340
00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:18,920
his friend Danny Rocha if he
knew anyone who could kill

341
00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:22,040
Sheila or at least cripple her.
Rocha said he could get someone

342
00:16:22,040 --> 00:16:24,960
to beat her.
God, I just, I can't.

343
00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:27,840
I don't understand people.
I don't understand people.

344
00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:31,200
Richard, The answer to that
should be you're crazy.

345
00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:33,080
What the hell?
Right.

346
00:16:33,120 --> 00:16:36,480
I mean, so how often have I
walked up to a friend and said,

347
00:16:36,480 --> 00:16:38,560
I'm just wondering, you know,
could you?

348
00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:42,120
No, I I don't want them dead
necessarily, but I would like

349
00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:44,280
them tragically injured.
Could you help me out?

350
00:16:44,520 --> 00:16:47,760
I mean, come on, even this had
not crossed my mind ever to ask

351
00:16:47,760 --> 00:16:50,440
anyone for any reason.
Well, the one time, but anyway.

352
00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:55,160
So Alec, he wanted her crippled
in a wheelchair chair with no

353
00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:56,400
tongue.
That's so.

354
00:16:56,640 --> 00:16:59,160
That's pretty particular.
Yeah, that's right.

355
00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:01,760
It's so creepy.
Well, and also.

356
00:17:01,760 --> 00:17:04,480
OK, think about this.
I am your golf partner and you

357
00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:08,280
say that to me exactly.
And you know here we are nurses

358
00:17:08,280 --> 00:17:11,400
with training, right?
And if we ever have anyone I

359
00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:14,839
think of suicidal ideation.
If they ever have a plan, that's

360
00:17:14,839 --> 00:17:16,880
when we wear big red flags and
call for help.

361
00:17:17,040 --> 00:17:19,319
You talk to me and have a
specific plan.

362
00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:23,560
This is not just something I
ignore, but then again also I'm

363
00:17:23,560 --> 00:17:25,960
not someone who would ever do do
that, so maybe there's the

364
00:17:25,960 --> 00:17:28,160
catch.
Okay, so his good buddy, who is

365
00:17:28,160 --> 00:17:29,920
obviously an upstanding person,
said.

366
00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:33,280
Yeah, just lovely citizen.
So Alan offered Rocha an

367
00:17:33,360 --> 00:17:36,160
ownership stake in a golf course
venture and later increased the

368
00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:40,200
offer to $50,000 if he got
custody of the girls.

369
00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:44,960
Rocha agreed and passed the task
to Sammy Gonzalez, who was

370
00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:49,880
Rocha's cousin, and Sammy
recruited his cousin Jose Luis

371
00:17:49,920 --> 00:17:51,000
Joey Del.
Toro.

372
00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:55,040
His sounds a little bit mobbish.
The terms from Rocha to Sammy

373
00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:59,560
for $4000 upfront, $1000 to Del
Toro and $10,000 bonus of

374
00:17:59,560 --> 00:18:01,960
custody was agreed.
So that's interesting too, that

375
00:18:01,960 --> 00:18:06,760
Rocha is like and I get $35,000
rock'n'roll.

376
00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:08,960
Exactly.
And you're the one at risk.

377
00:18:10,240 --> 00:18:11,360
Exactly.
Sounds fair.

378
00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:14,400
Eventually the plot evolved from
beating her to murder, and Alan

379
00:18:14,400 --> 00:18:16,320
made sure no trace would lead
back to him.

380
00:18:16,320 --> 00:18:19,480
Of course, Jumper in the ocean
or Barrier in the woods, he

381
00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:22,280
said.
However, he may have noticed

382
00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:24,440
ultimately, a trace LED back to
him.

383
00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:27,680
You can't just do this.
I mean, when you're talking,

384
00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:30,400
when you're talking to people
that that have this kind of

385
00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:33,480
morals, I don't understand why
anyone ever in the whole world

386
00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:35,200
says, oh, I can trust you,
right?

387
00:18:36,120 --> 00:18:40,240
I mean, how dumb is that?
If they have 0 morals, they're

388
00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:42,040
going to absolutely look out for
number 1.

389
00:18:42,040 --> 00:18:42,840
I didn't do it.
He did.

390
00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:45,520
Yeah.
Anyway, yeah, go ahead.

391
00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:49,640
OK, so del Toro agreed to do it?
Obviously, yes.

392
00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:54,120
On November 4th, 1997, Rocha
Gonzalez and del Toro met.

393
00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:59,200
Del Toro agreed to go to Florida
for $4000 with the possibility

394
00:18:59,200 --> 00:19:02,560
of a significant incentive.
He was given Sheila's Sarasota

395
00:19:02,560 --> 00:19:05,320
address and advised to park near
a strip mall.

396
00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:08,960
Dress casually attack while
Jamie is away with a.

397
00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:11,440
Assault preferred.
Dress casually.

398
00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:15,440
Because that's not very.
That's stupid as hell.

399
00:19:15,720 --> 00:19:18,880
Oh my gosh, this is it's a
business casual event.

400
00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:24,760
Please dress accordingly.
OK, so he left San Antonio on

401
00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:27,040
November 5th.
So the day after they met he

402
00:19:27,040 --> 00:19:31,280
called into probably Gonzalez or
Brocha, probably Gonzalez and

403
00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:34,040
said he was on the way.
And he reached Sarasota on

404
00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:37,600
November 6th.
So he drove all the way from the

405
00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:41,960
1200 miles from San Antonio to
Sarasota, FL in one day.

406
00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:47,360
Here's another part where it
gets weirdly interesting.

407
00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:50,200
He drove to Sarasota.
This is so weird.

408
00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:52,960
Equipped with camouflage?
Sorry.

409
00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:58,920
That was his casual dress.
Equipped with camouflage, a gun

410
00:19:59,000 --> 00:20:02,720
and adult diapers, he wanted to
avoid bathroom stops to minimize

411
00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:04,840
the risk of being seen or tied
to the crime.

412
00:20:04,920 --> 00:20:08,160
Oh, for heaven's sakes, yes.
Also, she's going to Sarasota,

413
00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:11,560
FL in his camos.
I feel like if you were going to

414
00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:16,600
Montana or somewhere but Sarah.
Wouldn't you rather wear like

415
00:20:17,120 --> 00:20:21,160
1/2 buttoned up button up shirt
and like some Bermuda shorts?

416
00:20:21,360 --> 00:20:21,920
Baby.
Yeah.

417
00:20:21,920 --> 00:20:25,320
And when we're talking that time
frame where Don Johnson was the

418
00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:28,440
person to be, so you had to have
that kind of a look.

419
00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:31,560
Miami.
Yeah, which we all know Miami is

420
00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:34,880
not the same thing as Sarasota,
but still.

421
00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:36,920
I mean, or a golf shirt, for
heavens sakes.

422
00:20:36,920 --> 00:20:41,320
But camos wow, these these two
sound like they're genius so

423
00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:43,480
far, but go ahead, I'm
interested to see how far they

424
00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:43,720
go.
I.

425
00:20:43,720 --> 00:20:45,720
Want to?
I want to be very clear.

426
00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:48,360
We're not laughing at murder.
We're laughing at this idiot.

427
00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:50,080
OK?
This guy is a moron.

428
00:20:50,120 --> 00:20:53,440
That's true, we do not
appreciate murder because wow,

429
00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:57,640
just could you not use your?
Words OK, so he rented a car in

430
00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:00,480
his grandmother's name, shopped
at the Sports Authority for the

431
00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:04,640
camo, and then when he got to
Sarasota, he scouted the Baluche

432
00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:07,200
neighborhood.
In his camo in.

433
00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:10,320
His camo.
Fortunately for him, a neighbor

434
00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:12,840
noted the Texas plates.
Yeah, of course.

435
00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:16,480
So whoopsies.
All that all that adult diaper

436
00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:20,320
business and he had Texas plates
and it he was.

437
00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:22,320
Clocked.
Immediately clocked immediately.

438
00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:24,960
Exactly.
So, so weird.

439
00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:29,040
On the afternoon of November
7th, 1997, Del Toro entered the

440
00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:32,680
Bluesh home via an unlocked
window or possibly garage.

441
00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:35,920
But still.
Lock your stuff up, people.

442
00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:38,560
Especially if you have a
psychotic accident.

443
00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:41,960
Especially if you have a
psychotic X bro.

444
00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:43,960
It's pretty.
It's pretty surprising.

445
00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:47,840
But you know what also, I mean,
of course we are saying these

446
00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:50,640
things and it's easy to
quarterback, of course, what's

447
00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:52,360
that called?
Quarterback, whatever.

448
00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:55,840
But still, if there's a
psychotic X out there, I mean, I

449
00:21:56,200 --> 00:21:59,240
have a psychotic X, but he's
handily in prison.

450
00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:00,960
So that's it.
Fortunately in prison.

451
00:22:01,360 --> 00:22:04,000
Right.
However, it's hard to move out

452
00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:06,680
of fear, and I think once a
person's moved out of fear, it

453
00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:10,120
feels so much better.
Yeah, it's almost hard to

454
00:22:10,120 --> 00:22:13,200
remember to do the things.
I mean, I, as I mentioned

455
00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:17,440
before, am pretty obsessive
about locking things and closing

456
00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:17,880
things.
I.

457
00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:20,080
Actually, I'm too.
I don't like to leave windows

458
00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:21,920
open.
I certainly lock my doors at

459
00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:23,680
night.
And I don't, I don't know why.

460
00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:27,360
I mean, I just I kind of an
innate fear of people breaking

461
00:22:27,360 --> 00:22:28,640
in.
It's probably because of my

462
00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:30,840
murder obsession, my true crime
obsession, to be honest.

463
00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:32,400
But.
Sorry, maybe.

464
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:36,120
Anyway, we digressed.
So he went in at some by some

465
00:22:36,120 --> 00:22:39,600
unlocked method potentially.
Yes, he found Sheila and her

466
00:22:39,680 --> 00:22:43,320
toddler quadruplets, so again,
they were two years old.

467
00:22:43,800 --> 00:22:46,800
Yeah, he pulled a 45 caliber
pistol, shot her once in the

468
00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:50,240
face, used the gun's butt to
strike her again when it jammed

469
00:22:50,280 --> 00:22:51,880
and then slit her throat with a
knife.

470
00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:55,600
Sheila crawled into the kitchen,
trying to reach the phone to

471
00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:59,600
dial, you know, 911 for help,
but she succumbed to blood loss.

472
00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:03,080
Yeah, I guess.
Around 3:00 PM, Sheila's now 13

473
00:23:03,080 --> 00:23:04,960
year old daughter Stevie
returned from school.

474
00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:08,120
She found her mother dead on the
kitchen floor.

475
00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:10,960
And here's where it just.
I was going to say quadruple

476
00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:12,760
breaks my heart, but that's
really nerdy because we're

477
00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:16,040
talking about quadruples, but
this is where it just ends.

478
00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:20,960
Infinitesimally breaks my heart.
The toddlers, barefoot, were

479
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:23,920
wandering between rooms, toys
smeared in blood, leaving their

480
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:27,360
tiny footprints across floors,
rugs and furniture.

481
00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,920
They wore life vests Sheila had
put them on just before changing

482
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:33,480
one of their diapers to prevent
the others from wandering to the

483
00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:34,640
pool.
Oh my gosh.

484
00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:36,720
Yeah, all tragically irrelevant
now.

485
00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:41,920
Wow, wow.
So Del Toro fled to Mexico on

486
00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:44,040
November 11th.
Police traced the rental car,

487
00:23:44,120 --> 00:23:47,000
rental car in camouflage.
They identified him through

488
00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:49,360
fingerprints.
So he was just such a careful

489
00:23:49,360 --> 00:23:52,120
guy.
All that camouflage and adult

490
00:23:52,120 --> 00:23:57,000
diapers and left fingerprints.
Well, you know, I guess when

491
00:23:57,160 --> 00:24:01,880
like you said, I maybe said mob
connections earlier, but now

492
00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:05,400
clearly not because these guys
definitely have no training.

493
00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:08,080
No, definitely not.
Well.

494
00:24:09,120 --> 00:24:11,840
So the police were able to work
with Mexican authorities to

495
00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:14,960
extradite him after Florida
agreed not to seek the death

496
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,800
penalty.
He returned in July 1999.

497
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:20,400
That's almost two years after
the murder.

498
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:25,000
Pled guilty and received 2
consecutive life sentences, the

499
00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:27,960
Florida maximum on each count in
mid 2000.

500
00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:30,680
Rocha.
As in maximum hold on one second

501
00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:33,560
maximum, meaning the death
penalty wasn't a possibility.

502
00:24:33,640 --> 00:24:34,320
Correct.
Yep.

503
00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:36,040
Because I'm like 2 life
sentences.

504
00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:39,360
That's sort of the end, isn't?
It Mexico would not extradite

505
00:24:39,360 --> 00:24:41,880
him unless Florida agreed not to
seek the death penalty.

506
00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:44,240
So Florida right, the death
penalty, but they were like

507
00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:47,240
Mexico was like Nah, not unless
you say you're not going to kill

508
00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:49,160
him and they were like all
right, send him home.

509
00:24:49,240 --> 00:24:53,400
I mean, send him over whatever.
So I can, I can go on a whole

510
00:24:53,400 --> 00:24:57,520
diatribe about prison and
whatever, prison for profit,

511
00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:00,080
etcetera, etcetera, but I
digress as well.

512
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:04,000
OK, Rocha, again, the golf buddy
was convicted of first degree

513
00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:07,880
murder in early 1999 thanks to
Gonzalez's testimony.

514
00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:11,400
There's so many people in this
story.

515
00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:15,200
And this does not so many
people, yeah, No one's going to

516
00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:17,240
keep a secret.
Yeah, Rocha got life without

517
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:20,720
parole.
Gonzalez pled guilty earlier and

518
00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:24,240
I'm sure because of his his
cooperation, Rocha's trial got

519
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:27,600
19 years. 19 years for
coordinating this murder.

520
00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:29,680
Yeah, for being the go between,
between Rocha.

521
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:32,720
So it's interesting because
Rocha got murder life without

522
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:36,760
parole.
Del Toro got murder life, I

523
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:39,360
guess without parole, just his
life sentence, but I'm sure

524
00:25:39,360 --> 00:25:42,360
without parole.
And then the in between guy just

525
00:25:42,360 --> 00:25:45,240
got 19 years for maybe
conspiracy.

526
00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:47,800
Yeah, I guess he didn't pull the
trigger.

527
00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:50,120
But not a friend.
Fun friend.

528
00:25:50,320 --> 00:25:52,920
Yeah, not a fun friend.
It it had to have been a

529
00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:55,200
cooperation deal.
Yeah, he was.

530
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:57,680
He was the snitch.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

531
00:25:57,760 --> 00:25:59,000
I'm going to clap my hands
again.

532
00:25:59,960 --> 00:26:04,920
The mastermind.
Mastermind is a very loose term.

533
00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:08,560
At this point, definitely.
In January 2000, federal

534
00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:11,880
authorities arrested Alan
Blackthorn in San Antonio,

535
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:14,640
charging him with Interstate
conspiracy to commit murder for

536
00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:17,200
hire and Interstate domestic
violence.

537
00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:20,040
And I really appreciate the
Interstate domestic violence

538
00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:24,160
because even if he hadn't had
her murder, yeah, even if he

539
00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:27,720
hadn't had her murder, all of
the spying and conspiring and

540
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:30,040
all of that is definitely
domestic violence.

541
00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:32,920
Yeah, he may not have laid a
hand on her, but that's

542
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:36,440
horrifying and it's, I hate it,
so I'm glad.

543
00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:40,440
He well and like you said, yeah,
the fact that they put that

544
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:43,240
charge on him and as I
mentioned, the fact that it's

545
00:26:43,240 --> 00:26:46,160
Interstate and both things were
Interstate moves it into the

546
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:49,600
federal arena instead of state.
So the penalties can be much

547
00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:50,520
higher.
Much higher.

548
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:53,680
Yep.
So his trial began in June 2000

549
00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:58,520
and federal court in Texas with
no cameras allowed.

550
00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:02,280
But jurors heard over 400 pieces
of evidence tying him to the

551
00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:04,760
plot.
Danny Rocha, testifying from

552
00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:09,160
prison, named Black Blackthorn
as the mastermind and financier.

553
00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:12,080
Other witnesses, private
investigators, ex associates,

554
00:27:12,080 --> 00:27:15,720
even phone recordings showed
Alan coldly gathering Sheila's

555
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:18,680
address, instructing on where
and when the hit should occur

556
00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:20,840
and being precise in his
demands.

557
00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:23,920
So wait, Dingleberry left
voicemails about this?

558
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:28,160
Apparently so she's.
Well, clearly not a trained

559
00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:30,240
professional, which is good
because that means.

560
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:31,640
He's captured.
You know what?

561
00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:32,640
I.
Mean like just a.

562
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:35,720
Domineering jerk.
And and you know, it's amazing

563
00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:39,640
too, because they were divorced
for gosh, 13 years probably by

564
00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:41,080
then.
I mean, I'm not doing math

565
00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:44,440
because I'm not that worried
about 8 years, but long enough.

566
00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:47,280
Get out of your life.
Yeah, let it go, bro.

567
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:49,560
Wow, wow.
And you know, some people,

568
00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:51,240
especially narcissists have a
really hard time.

569
00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:54,440
I'm seeing people that they
wanted to make miserable happy

570
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:56,560
because that means they're out
of control.

571
00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:58,360
And narcissists do not want to
be that.

572
00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:01,040
And we're obviously not
diagnosing because we are not

573
00:28:01,360 --> 00:28:06,320
trained medical providers.
However, this does have no.

574
00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:09,200
However, this does sound like
there's a narcissistic portion

575
00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:10,760
of the event.
Go ahead.

576
00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:13,720
So 400 pieces of evidence or
testimony, I guess you said?

577
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:17,480
He once coldly insisted to A to
a witness who testified.

578
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:20,720
Find her.
I want her on tape.

579
00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:23,000
He asked bail bondsman for
Sheila's address.

580
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:25,920
I'm really not sure why a bail
bondsman would have Sheila's

581
00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:29,360
address, but.
Well, because they can search

582
00:28:29,360 --> 00:28:33,160
records and it would have been,
now it's illegal, but people who

583
00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:35,640
had access to these sorts of
things were pretty Willy nilly

584
00:28:35,640 --> 00:28:38,200
about being able to find
addresses at will.

585
00:28:38,200 --> 00:28:41,360
And a bail, a bail bondsman
would have all of the the

586
00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:44,800
ability to do so because they
have that access for finding

587
00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:46,360
their.
Bail not only we have phone

588
00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:49,240
books where we were listing
every single person in the

589
00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:51,240
freaking country for.
Sure.

590
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:53,640
Wow.
Yeah, The bondsman would have

591
00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:57,000
had access to DMV records and
things like that as well.

592
00:28:57,760 --> 00:28:58,080
Wow.
He's.

593
00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:00,720
Such a jerk to his daughter
recording.

594
00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:02,960
That's just why.
Yeah, to his daughter.

595
00:29:03,080 --> 00:29:05,840
He pretended he'd visit during
Christmas to trick her into

596
00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:09,200
revealing where Sheila lived.
Jurors were shown that he had no

597
00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:11,160
contact with his daughters after
the murder.

598
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:13,280
Not a Christmas card, a call,
nothing.

599
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:16,960
This idea that he would visit
for Christmas was just

600
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:19,840
absolutely narcissistic.
I had nothing to do with his

601
00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:22,120
daughter.
It was all about finding Sheila.

602
00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:24,000
Just manipulating for
information.

603
00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:27,400
Yep, just manipulating somebody
that he I'm sure he saw as naive

604
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:30,400
enough to cave.
And it sounds like she didn't.

605
00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:36,720
So on July 6th, 2000, after more
than 33 hours of deliberation,

606
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:41,600
imagine being that jury.
Blackthorn was found guilty on

607
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:43,920
both counts.
He received life without parole

608
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:46,000
in Florida.
Simultaneously.

609
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:49,480
Del Toro was sentenced to life.
Jamie Belouche confronted Del

610
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:52,720
Toro in court, telling him you
are a worthless coward.

611
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:55,600
Put this cowardly, worthless
animal in a cage where he can

612
00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,000
rot away.
Del Toro nodded.

613
00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:00,480
I do deserve to be punished,
this terrible thing I did.

614
00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:05,160
I do have to say I do agree with
Jamie Belousch that del Toro is

615
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:07,840
a worthless coward.
But I don't agree with calling

616
00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:09,360
people animals, no, no matter
what.

617
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:14,320
There's a limit, huh?
You know, when when you come to

618
00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:17,520
someone like del Toro, who
clearly did not have a lot of

619
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:21,360
experience with this, this is
where I wonder what made him do

620
00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:23,280
it.
What kind of position was he in

621
00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:25,280
that he felt like this was a
good idea?

622
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:27,520
And what kind of history did he
have and all of that stuff.

623
00:30:27,520 --> 00:30:31,560
I have no sympathy for him.
However, it just makes me wonder

624
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:34,800
how a person can get there.
And, and you know, all of us, I

625
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:36,600
think have been in our lives
desperate.

626
00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:40,640
However, most of us have a limit
and most of us have a limit that

627
00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:44,080
is within legal and moral stand.
That part to me is quite

628
00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:45,840
fascinating.
Yeah, I agree.

629
00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:48,480
He does sound like he has
remorse as well, but then you

630
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:50,640
wonder, is it remorse because
now he's in prison for.

631
00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:53,000
Everybody, it's, it's that I'm
sorry because I was caught.

632
00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:54,120
Nothing.
I'm sorry because I did it.

633
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:57,840
Although he did, although he did
specifically, I do deserve

634
00:30:57,840 --> 00:30:59,600
punished for this terrible thing
I did.

635
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:01,920
Yeah, so that sounds like
remorse to me.

636
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:05,240
Yeah, it does for the action.
And he didn't say, gosh, I'm

637
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:07,320
really sorry I got caught
because I was a dingleberry.

638
00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:09,920
Yeah, dingleberries in same
sentence.

639
00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:15,280
Going back, I mean, I, I thought
about this a lot just because I

640
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:19,160
am a true crime aficionado, if
you will.

641
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:21,600
I'm just kidding.
That's way too sophisticated A.

642
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:24,320
Term but junk junkie?
Well.

643
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:26,840
I don't want to steal their
title.

644
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:29,600
Well, it is a word though I
talk.

645
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:36,560
To two crime junkies, I just
don't see a situation where I

646
00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:40,680
could be compelled to shoot a
woman in the face, hit her with

647
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,360
the gun and slit her throat.
I just, I mean, I don't.

648
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:44,840
Especially because you didn't
know her.

649
00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:47,400
I mean, he didn't know her.
It wasn't like he was defending

650
00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:49,360
himself, right?
That's totally different.

651
00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:51,760
Just a random stranger.
Because somebody said I should

652
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:55,360
for.
And what was it, like $6000 plus

653
00:31:55,400 --> 00:31:58,080
the money he got later?
Though maybe money later it was

654
00:31:58,160 --> 00:31:59,680
maybe money.
And that's the thing.

655
00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:03,320
That's the thing that baffles me
about a lot of Murder for Hire.

656
00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:05,960
There's there's a show and I'm
going to be honest, I do not

657
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:08,320
remember what it's called, but
it's all about Kevin watching

658
00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:10,360
Murder for Hire.
And actually it, I wish I could

659
00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:14,160
remember the name of it, but it
uses, they set up these people

660
00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:17,400
who already know that there's a
murder for hire plot happening.

661
00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:20,400
And so they insert basically,
why can't I think of the word?

662
00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:23,360
Oh not is it a sting?
But a yeah, it's a sting

663
00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:24,720
operation.
Yes, exactly.

664
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:27,040
And they record it and
everything and then the person

665
00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:30,160
gets, you know, gets arrested
and convicted, etcetera.

666
00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:33,560
Right.
But what baffles me, what shocks

667
00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:36,040
me is sometimes what people will
do it for.

668
00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:39,840
You know, there's like 16 year
old kids, they'll do it for 500

669
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:42,120
bucks.
When you consider the big, you

670
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:45,640
know, the big picture of the
scheme of all things, 500 bucks

671
00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:50,160
is nothing, nothing, nothing.
I wouldn't like, I wouldn't

672
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:51,800
break it.
Well, I wouldn't, I don't commit

673
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:55,440
crimes, but I wouldn't break
into somebody's house and steal

674
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:57,880
a ring for 500 bucks.
You know what I mean?

675
00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:01,520
Something theoretically, no
harmless, right, right.

676
00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:06,880
Just these, these people, you
know, 1000 dollars, $2000, even

677
00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:09,960
$4000.
I mean, again, I'm, I'm not one

678
00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:13,360
you can compel to murder, but
I'm thinking 1,000,000 dollars,

679
00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:16,720
$10 million maybe.
I mean, not maybe for me really,

680
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:19,760
but for somebody he's inclined
to do it right, Somebody who

681
00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:22,680
would do it for at least.
It might be worth the risk.

682
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:24,840
Yeah, exactly.
Like I just.

683
00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:29,800
It blows my mind how there's so
little, it seems there's so

684
00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:34,840
little forethought and this idea
of this quick cash in exchange

685
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:38,160
for such a heavy consequence,
right?

686
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:40,680
Like it's just mine.
It's mind blowing.

687
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:42,800
I mean, I've already said that,
just like you said dingleberry

688
00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:45,600
twice.
It it just I, it renders me

689
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:50,640
speechless truly, because it's
just so insignificant in the big

690
00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:52,760
picture.
And you know, these are, these

691
00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:55,400
are the people that are caught
and I don't know, maybe there

692
00:33:55,400 --> 00:33:57,400
are people, people who get paid
millions of dollars who don't

693
00:33:57,400 --> 00:33:58,720
get caught.
So we don't hear their story.

694
00:33:58,720 --> 00:34:02,880
I, I don't know.
But there are far, far too many

695
00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:08,719
stories of murder for hire where
the payment is inconsequential

696
00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:12,000
and just absolutely, I mean, not
worth it to me.

697
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:14,400
And I don't understand it.
I don't understand it.

698
00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:17,520
And I guess in the case of young
kids, you know, young adults,

699
00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:20,560
they're, you know, their brains
haven't finished forming and

700
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:23,280
their logic center is not fully
formed, etcetera.

701
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:26,400
But but it's just sad, I guess.
I mean, that's reality when

702
00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:28,800
we're talking about these kids
that don't have the don't have

703
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:31,679
the brain function to to think
about tomorrow, to think about

704
00:34:31,679 --> 00:34:33,760
the consequences.
You know, they're thinking, yay,

705
00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:35,920
the new Xbox, right.
Exactly.

706
00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:38,520
New shoes, whatever.
New shoes or whatever.

707
00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:40,880
Yeah.
And so new kicks, as it were,

708
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:44,000
the whole murder for hire.
I just, I don't understand it.

709
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:47,000
I do not understand it.
Again, maybe maybe there are

710
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:48,880
people who are paid millions
that we don't hear about.

711
00:34:48,880 --> 00:34:51,120
I don't even understand that.
I don't want to imply that I

712
00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:53,600
understand that, but I
especially don't understand when

713
00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:56,560
it's pennies in the in the grand
scheme of things.

714
00:34:56,679 --> 00:35:01,120
Sure, and I think I can see it a
little bit more of maybe it's a

715
00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:03,240
drug addict and they just have
to get their next hit.

716
00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:07,120
But this guy, I mean, and even
that, again, I'm not saying I

717
00:35:07,120 --> 00:35:10,760
condone it and I don't think
that's a good idea, but at least

718
00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:14,400
for to me, there's a driver that
has nothing to do with thought.

719
00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:18,960
This guy sounds like he'd never
done it before because for him

720
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:21,760
and sakes, it doesn't sound like
he's even wearing gloves and

721
00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:24,360
renting the car in his mother's
name and having to see

722
00:35:24,880 --> 00:35:25,760
grandmother.
Yes, sorry.

723
00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:30,400
And having the receipt for his
stuff, his camo, which also and

724
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:33,320
the state an out of state plate.
I have a friend who's a Private

725
00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:35,880
Eye.
When she would go to sit in

726
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:39,680
neighborhoods for the reasons
she was investigating, she would

727
00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:41,360
make sure she had three
different cars.

728
00:35:41,640 --> 00:35:43,800
She would make sure that she was
in the car that was appropriate

729
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:45,760
for the neighborhood.
And they all had the state plate

730
00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:49,200
of the state she was in, which
was Utah in this case.

731
00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:53,000
But she thought about it.
She knew that in order not to

732
00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:55,640
stick out, this is what she'd
have to do.

733
00:35:56,040 --> 00:36:01,760
And but this guy, it doesn't.
I mean, for heaven's sakes.

734
00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:05,520
We were saying camouflage in
Sarasota, FL.

735
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:08,440
Yeah, read your audience.
Exactly.

736
00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:12,800
And who knows, maybe he was
intellectually challenged and

737
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:15,040
didn't even know how to think
about that sort of thing.

738
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:17,760
And and that could explain some
of it, that he just had enough

739
00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:20,760
pressure from his buddy or
cousin, I think it was.

740
00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:23,000
And just.
And that's why that he was the

741
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:26,000
Patsy, as it were, because he
was dumb enough to do it.

742
00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:28,960
But then you think about the
cousin who coordinated with

743
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:30,440
someone who was dumb enough to
do it.

744
00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:32,840
And then I mean just the whole
thing.

745
00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:35,760
And what did they say?
There's a quote about secrets.

746
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:39,440
If you tell more than one other
person, it will never ever be a

747
00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:42,520
secret again because that person
will tell someone else.

748
00:36:42,760 --> 00:36:45,320
The only secret is the one that
you keep to yourself for always.

749
00:36:45,320 --> 00:36:47,120
That's just wild.
It's crazy.

750
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:50,040
I just don't don't get it.
So do you know what the outcome

751
00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:52,200
of things for the family was?
I do.

752
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:54,760
As a matter of fact.
I'd love to hear it, hopefully

753
00:36:54,760 --> 00:36:57,000
it's good.
Alan Blackthorn died in federal

754
00:36:57,000 --> 00:37:00,760
prison on November 8th, 2014 at
the age of 59.

755
00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:07,720
Which, Yes, FM Yeah, she was.
She lives.

756
00:37:07,720 --> 00:37:10,120
Oldest daughters never saw her
their father again.

757
00:37:10,120 --> 00:37:13,320
So that's Stevie and Darrell,
thank God, because he doesn't

758
00:37:13,320 --> 00:37:16,400
deserve them.
They sure don't deserve him in

759
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:17,720
the negative sense.
Right?

760
00:37:17,720 --> 00:37:22,160
Like, stay away, good girls.
Jamie raised all six children,

761
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:24,720
honoring Sheila's memory by
sharing stories of her kindness,

762
00:37:24,720 --> 00:37:26,400
faith, and her fierce love for
her family.

763
00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:31,280
OK, here's a fun twist.
Anne Ruhl wrote Every Breath You

764
00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:36,480
Take at Sheila's own request.
Quote if anything happens to me,

765
00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:39,080
find Anne Rule and have her
write my story.

766
00:37:39,240 --> 00:37:40,840
Chills.
Chills.

767
00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:43,600
Oh my gosh, me too.
Oh my.

768
00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:47,360
Goodness.
So it became a sorry please.

769
00:37:48,080 --> 00:37:51,120
Oh, I was going to say I, I
watched this lady online and

770
00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:54,960
she's Peaches and she has her
murder book, the Dateline murder

771
00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:58,040
book and she's doing it tongue
in cheek, of course, but she

772
00:37:58,040 --> 00:38:00,280
says she says some of the same
sorts of things.

773
00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:02,880
If something really happens,
which she is not in a position

774
00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:04,840
that that's going to happen,
She's really doing a tongue in

775
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:07,840
cheek because she watched the
Dateline and Keith Morrison and

776
00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:10,280
all of that.
But when a person says if

777
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:15,000
something happens to me, you
know that they're worried,

778
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:18,400
especially if they something say
something specific and they have

779
00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:21,240
an ex like this guy.
This is just how often.

780
00:38:21,240 --> 00:38:23,360
Do you hear that?
If something happens to me, it

781
00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:26,600
was dot dot dot, right?
We hear that far too often.

782
00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:28,920
Yeah, so many times, because
they know.

783
00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:31,080
It happens.
Because they know there.

784
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:33,080
Something did happen, and it was
that person.

785
00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:35,960
Yeah.
And I mean in the in the stories

786
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:39,120
that were investigated and
solved many, many times, that's

787
00:38:39,120 --> 00:38:42,240
the case.
And as we know, many murders are

788
00:38:42,240 --> 00:38:44,920
because of a domestic violence
situation situation.

789
00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:49,000
And most murders happen by
someone the person knows.

790
00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:50,560
Yeah.
I mean, there are these outliers

791
00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:53,240
that happen and those are the
ones we hear about that are the

792
00:38:53,240 --> 00:38:57,000
fame infamous cases.
This sort of thing is is the

793
00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:58,920
most common though, sadly.
It is.

794
00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:01,160
It really is.
And she thought she was far

795
00:39:01,160 --> 00:39:05,000
enough away. 1200 miles.
That's so far away.

796
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:09,640
Yeah, yeah.
And so, OK, so Jamie kept her

797
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:12,960
history.
Yeah, so Jamie raised all six

798
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:16,080
children.
So her, her oldest daughters,

799
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:19,120
her two, her two oldest
daughters that she had with Alan

800
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:21,440
and then the quadruplets.
I done.

801
00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:24,240
I didn't see whether or not he
got remarried or anything like

802
00:39:24,240 --> 00:39:27,880
that.
I love a man who raises children

803
00:39:27,880 --> 00:39:33,560
that are not his as their as his
own because children deserve as

804
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:36,320
much love as they can possibly
get.

805
00:39:36,520 --> 00:39:39,280
And they had to have had some
huge traumas about it,

806
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:43,040
obviously, it at least of which
is that their mother was gone.

807
00:39:43,360 --> 00:39:45,920
But then to know that their
father, through their lives had

808
00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:49,760
manipulated them to try and find
her is just abhorrence.

809
00:39:49,760 --> 00:39:52,240
Yeah.
OK, So through Admiral's book

810
00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:55,640
Every Breath You Take, her story
reverberates not as a

811
00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:58,600
sensational true crime
narrative, but as a mother's

812
00:39:58,600 --> 00:40:00,560
final plea.
Every breath You Take and take

813
00:40:00,560 --> 00:40:03,600
those domestic violence,
manipulation, obsession and

814
00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:05,920
murder.
Sheila Belush was a mother, a

815
00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:09,560
survivor, a woman who found love
again and whose memory holds

816
00:40:09,560 --> 00:40:11,520
more weight than the horror of
her death.

817
00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:15,000
I do want to.
Do you have any final thoughts?

818
00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:17,320
First of all.
Well, I think the thing that you

819
00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:20,840
said about the fact that we
really get to remember the

820
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:25,360
contributions she had and the
life that she had built even

821
00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:28,680
more than her murder.
Because I think even though

822
00:40:28,680 --> 00:40:32,360
we're focusing on it for this
episode, to kind of anchor that

823
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:35,200
in that the life that she built
is the part that we get to

824
00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:37,360
recognize.
Because otherwise we're just

825
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:41,440
giving Alan her ex power again
every single time.

826
00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:46,440
And I feel like Jamie gets to
have the power and Sheila gets

827
00:40:46,440 --> 00:40:49,480
to have the power and the kids
get to have the the power, and

828
00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:51,960
that Alan will just write where
he belongs.

829
00:40:52,160 --> 00:40:55,520
Was dead, so I see right place.
Got it.

830
00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:59,240
The other place, the dark or the
OR the fiery, or however one

831
00:40:59,240 --> 00:41:01,440
believes the place.
Yeah.

832
00:41:01,440 --> 00:41:05,200
So we want to remember Sheila,
not as a statistic, right, but

833
00:41:05,640 --> 00:41:09,320
as a legacy of resilience of a
woman who looked for peace and

834
00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:13,160
found it and then in the end
asked the world to remember her

835
00:41:13,160 --> 00:41:16,840
truth and remember her for who
she was and to hold the

836
00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:19,680
perpetrators of this crime
accountable, which I fully

837
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:22,360
appreciate.
So do you want to end with just

838
00:41:22,360 --> 00:41:25,560
if this episode strikes accord,
remember that there is help out

839
00:41:25,560 --> 00:41:27,240
there.
For any listener impacted by

840
00:41:27,240 --> 00:41:30,360
domestic violence, the National
Domest, the National Domestic

841
00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:35,480
Violence Hotline is available
24/7 AT180799 safe.

842
00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:37,840
And I'm going to look real quick
and see what those numbers are

843
00:41:37,840 --> 00:41:39,880
because I always appreciate it
when people do that for me.

844
00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:49,480
So 1-800-799-7233, So
1-800-799-7233 or 1800 Seven 99

845
00:41:49,480 --> 00:41:50,760
safe.
Thank you.

846
00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:53,960
Go ahead.
I was just going to say too, if

847
00:41:53,960 --> 00:41:57,480
you're in a situation where you
hear someone say that if

848
00:41:57,480 --> 00:42:01,040
something happens to me, please
don't just say, oh Hun, that

849
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:04,960
wouldn't happen.
Really listen because they are

850
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:08,640
sending a message that they need
to be too afraid to list in any

851
00:42:08,640 --> 00:42:12,800
other kind of way.
And if it's coming out, then

852
00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:16,000
that's one of those times, like
I said, with things like suicide

853
00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:19,480
ideation and plans and things.
Take that next step if you can.

854
00:42:19,480 --> 00:42:24,000
And if you cannot help them,
find someone one who can because

855
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:28,160
these are the cries for help
that I think in a lot of cases,

856
00:42:28,160 --> 00:42:30,480
people who are involved in the
domestic violence, and I

857
00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:33,520
wouldn't even say a lot,
probably most of them have cried

858
00:42:33,520 --> 00:42:37,480
for help and haven't been heard.
And if we hear something, you

859
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:39,440
know, we hear it everywhere.
If you hear something, say

860
00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:42,360
something, a person isn't
usually saying it just because

861
00:42:42,360 --> 00:42:44,160
they want to light fire
somewhere.

862
00:42:44,160 --> 00:42:46,280
They really are calling for
help.

863
00:42:46,320 --> 00:42:48,440
If nothing else, ask now Wait,
what?

864
00:42:48,560 --> 00:42:50,200
What are you experiencing
something?

865
00:42:50,240 --> 00:42:53,920
Are you what is going on?
And I think most of us have an

866
00:42:53,920 --> 00:42:57,720
intuition on something like that
when we hear it, that this is a

867
00:42:57,720 --> 00:43:01,920
real thing and what's next.
So again, as a person who hears

868
00:43:01,920 --> 00:43:04,520
something like that, we can call
the domestic violence hotline

869
00:43:04,520 --> 00:43:08,720
and ask for suggestions as well.
And I think that's important

870
00:43:08,720 --> 00:43:12,240
because especially now since
we've all been so disconnected

871
00:43:12,240 --> 00:43:15,920
because we've been only online
with each other or something

872
00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:18,960
like that, it's easy to lose
those skills of personal

873
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:22,200
interaction.
And these are the times that

874
00:43:22,280 --> 00:43:24,880
that that we may need the
assistance, we may need someone

875
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:28,880
to guide us on what to do next.
And I just invite people to

876
00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:32,000
remember that as, as someone
hearing these things, please

877
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:33,200
take action.
I agree.

878
00:43:33,400 --> 00:43:36,680
Yeah, I agree.
And thank you for listening and

879
00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:39,680
I will see you next time.
All right, if you've made it

880
00:43:39,680 --> 00:43:42,320
this far, clearly you like a
little mayhem with your

881
00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:44,400
medicine.
Or you just enjoy hearing us

882
00:43:44,400 --> 00:43:46,240
ramble about weird medical
mysteries.

883
00:43:46,560 --> 00:43:48,120
Either way, we'd love you for
it.

884
00:43:48,360 --> 00:43:51,000
So hit that follow or subscribe
button wherever you're

885
00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:52,960
listening.
And toss us a rating or review

886
00:43:52,960 --> 00:43:55,960
while you're at it.
Helps other curious weirdos find

887
00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:58,640
the show.
And we know there are a lot of

888
00:43:58,640 --> 00:44:00,760
you out there.
Oh so many.

889
00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:03,160
Come join the chaos.
Thanks for listening to

890
00:44:03,160 --> 00:44:06,280
Medicine, Mystery, mayhem, and
sometimes Murder.

891
00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:10,040
If you have an idea for an
episode of this podcast, just

892
00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:14,240
Want to Say hi, you can get in
touch with us at our M4 pod.

893
00:44:14,680 --> 00:44:23,920
That's OURM the #4pod@gmail.com.
We read every e-mail, and

894
00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:27,240
sometimes we even respond just
like real professionals.

895
00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:31,840
Because we are.
Old friends with new twists and

896
00:44:31,840 --> 00:44:33,400
lots of body bags.